diy solar

diy solar

Want to buy new 48v system and have some questions...Need advice

OffGridIdaho

OffGridIdaho

Hobby Farm in N Idaho
Joined
Jun 18, 2020
Messages
254
Location
N Idaho
First off I want to thank the folks on this forum for bringing all the SS/EG4 issues to the fore-front. You saved me from making a HUGE costly mistake. I am so glad I didn't buy eg4 at this point!

I'm currently running a 24v lead acid system, A midnite kid CC and a Samlex Evo 24v inverter charger along with a honda 3k inverter gen and 1200w solar panels.
The batteries are 5 years old and not happy about pushing 50% soc everyday. This small system has served us well in our large tiny house (650sq ft). We use 3kw per day aprox.

I am looking at (2) SOK 48v batteries, a Samlex Evo LOW-FREQ 48v/4200w inverter charger and adding a few more panels. I have had extremely good luck with the samlex and they have awesome support out of Canada. The EVO, being low-freq, can really handle the big in-rush surge of a chest freezer, a well pump and the microwave.

My questions are the following;

What cells does the SOK use? I talked to another reseller and they spoke of having issues with CALB cells losing voltage after a few months. They have stopped selling them until the issue is rectified. Needless to say I do NOT want CALB cells.

My second question is about trees sweeping my panels as the earth rotates.What is the preferred way to string panels in a shading environment? What panels are best to buy? <-- ON EDIT ---- (Trees are on neighbors property.,Panels are in best location possible currently. )

My third question is do the SOK batteries stay in balance and NOT have the out of balance issue that the EG4's have? We might go 3 days before charging or getting sun up here. Bottom line is I don't want to buy anything that is problematic or needs constantly fussing over to work correctly. I also dont want to call tech support 3x per week to make the system run properly.
 
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Sorry I cannot answer your question but I can share that my GYLL ( EG4) battery has been working 24/7/365 flawlessly for over two years now. I think people who speak up are typically those who have issues. The majority are silent and happy IMHO.

I will also question your statement that CALB cells lose voltage after a few months. That is a very reputable company with millions of cells in service every day. Sounds like a salesman trying to switch you to what they are selling.

Be careful about what you read/hear from limited sources (n=1) including myself ?.
 
JoeHam said:
Sorry I cannot answer your question but I can share that my GYLL ( EG4) battery has been working 24/7/365 flawlessly for over two years now. I think people who speak up are typically those who have issues. The majority are silent and happy IMHO.

I will also question your statement that CALB cells lose voltage after a few months. That is a very reputable company with millions of cells in service every day. Sounds like a salesman trying to switch you to what they are selling.

Be careful about what you read/hear from limited sources (n=1) including myself ?.
Click to expand...
Maybe so but there are just too many complaints for my liking. Smoke there's fire.....
Also I trust the owner of the Co. I spoke to. He said they had the battery in stock but they were seeing many warranty replacements with the cells and had stopped selling them. He wasnt trying to sell me something else as he had nothing else to sell.
 
littleharbor2 said:
With the shading you are talking about you have a couple choices.
1, Move the panels to a sunnier area.
2, Cut the trees down or at least enough to stop the shading problem.
Solar panels are meant to be in full sun, period.
Click to expand...
Neither is option!
Trees on neighbors property.
Panels are in best location possible currently.
 
OffGridIdaho said:
First off I want to thank the folks on this forum for bringing all the SS/EG4 issues to the fore-front. You saved me from making a HUGE costly mistake. I am so glad I didn't buy eg4 at this point!

I'm currently running a 24v lead acid system, A midnite kid CC and a Samlex Evo 24v inverter charger along with a honda 3k inverter gen and 1200w solar panels.
The batteries are 5 years old and not happy about pushing 50% soc everyday. This small system has served us well in our large tiny house (650sq ft). We use 3kw per day aprox.

I am looking at (2) SOK 48v batteries, a Samlex Evo LOW-FREQ 48v/4200w inverter charger and adding a few more panels. I have had extremely good luck with the samlex and they have awesome support out of Canada. The EVO, being low-freq, can really handle the big in-rush surge of a chest freezer, a well pump and the microwave.

My questions are the following;

What cells does the SOK use? I talked to another reseller and they spoke of having issues with CALB cells losing voltage after a few months. They have stopped selling them until the issue is rectified. Needless to say I do NOT want CALB cells.

My second question is about trees sweeping my panels as the earth rotates.What is the preferred way to string panels in a shading environment? What panels are best to buy? <-- ON EDIT ---- (Trees are on neighbors property.,Panels are in best location possible currently. )

My third question is do the SOK batteries stay in balance and NOT have the out of balance issue that the EG4's have? We might go 3 days before charging or getting sun up here. Bottom line is I don't want to buy anything that is problematic or needs constantly fussing over to work correctly. I also dont want to call tech support 3x per week to make the system run properly.
Click to expand...
I use the EG4 - 48 volt batteries all the time in installs hand have never had any issues with cell balancing or diminished capacity. Was there some other reason you don't want to go with EG4?
 
Off Gridin' It said:
I use the EG4 - 48 volt batteries all the time in installs hand have never had any issues with cell balancing or diminished capacity. Was there some other reason you don't want to go with EG4?
Click to expand...
Didnt answer any of my questions.
1. Do soks stay balanced?
2. How do I string panels to work best in shading?
3. What cells do sok use

Can we not turn this into a eg4 fanboy thread?
I called sig sol 3x asking questions and was dissatisfied with their lack of answers.
 
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it's hard to recommend how to string your panels in shaded situations.

what are your VOC requirements? how many strings/panels? what does your mount look like? dimensions? assuming a ground mount.

it's probably going to be best to position panels in a string stacked vertically as much as possible, rather than horizontally. you want to maximize each string's exposure, not the array.
 
OffGridIdaho said:
Didnt answer any of my questions.
1. Do soks stay balanced?
2. How do I string panels to work best in shading?
3. What cells do sok use

Can we not turn this into a eg4 fanboy thread?
I called sig sol 3x asking questions and was dissatisfied with their lack of answers.
Click to expand...
It wasn't a fanboy statement. I am both a signature solar affiliate and an SOK affiliate partner so I use and install both. I was asking a valid question to gather information. I wanted to see if you have actually used EG4 rack mounted batteries or are you just assuming there could be an issue?

I haven't seen any problems with either one of these batteries although EG4 batteries are more cost effective and less per watt than SOK unless you go with the EG4 with the built in monitor. Although once I install EG4 batteries I have never had the need to ever look at them again so I personally don't see the need for the monitor version but that simply comes down to preference.

I have not seen any balancing issues with SOK batteries I have installed of any model battery.
SOK uses aluminium cased prismatic cells.

Panel Shading
If you are in a shaded are then either all panels in parallel or Series/Parallel is best.
Something to consider when putting panels in all parallel is that this will add the current (Amps) of the panels. So using a typical 100 watt panel as and example they will have a VOC of around 21 volts and an IMP of around 5.5 amps. If you have 4 panels in parallel you would end up with a total array value of 21 volts at 22 amps. That would give maximum protection against shade. If you had 8 panels then that would push the current up to 44 amps and that is no good. MC4 connectors are only rated for 30 amps and in many cases the PV wire itself isn't rated for that much current. This is when you would move to a Series Parallel Configuration which would add the voltage and current. So you would have a total array value of 42 volts at 22 amps.

Higher voltage will allow earlier charging in the morning and keep charging later in the day so do recommend the Series/Parallel connection in most cases.

Tell me the wattage of the panels you have and the VOC and IMP of each panel. Also what charge controller do you have?
I can make a recommendation.
 
Off Gridin' It said:
It wasn't a fanboy statement. I am both a signature solar affiliate and an SOK affiliate partner so I use and install both. I was asking a valid question to gather information. I wanted to see if you have actually used EG4 rack mounted batteries or are you just assuming there could be an issue?

I haven't seen any problems with either one of these batteries although EG4 batteries are more cost effective and less per watt than SOK unless you go with the EG4 with the built in monitor. Although once I install EG4 batteries I have never had the need to ever look at them again so I personally don't see the need for the monitor version but that simply comes down to preference.

I have not seen any balancing issues with SOK batteries I have installed of any model battery.
SOK uses aluminium cased prismatic cells.

Panel Shading
If you are in a shaded are then either all panels in parallel or Series/Parallel is best.
Something to consider when putting panels in all parallel is that this will add the current (Amps) of the panels. So using a typical 100 watt panel as and example they will have a VOC of around 21 volts and an IMP of around 5.5 amps. If you have 4 panels in parallel you would end up with a total array value of 21 volts at 22 amps. That would give maximum protection against shade. If you had 8 panels then that would push the current up to 44 amps and that is no good. MC4 connectors are only rated for 30 amps and in many cases the PV wire itself isn't rated for that much current. This is when you would move to a Series Parallel Configuration which would add the voltage and current. So you would have a total array value of 42 volts at 22 amps.

Higher voltage will allow earlier charging in the morning and keep charging later in the day so do recommend the Series/Parallel connection in most cases.

Tell me the wattage of the panels you have and the VOC and IMP of each panel. Also what charge controller do you have?
I can make a recommendation.
Click to expand...
So should I buy the 50/50 (top/bottom) solar cells? Also I was told that running 4P panels to a combiner box makes them the same as series and one blocked, blocks them all. Is that not the case? Are SOK's using "EVE" branded cells? Can I put diodes on each panel to prevent backflow during shading?
 
Biasjo said:
Man I’m glad I live on 20 acres.
Neighbors trees shading my panels. No thanks..
Click to expand...
N idaho sun gets so low in winter 20ac and tall trees on neighbors land would still block you. Plus 20ac in coeur d alene would mean $20,000 a year in property taxes.
 
OffGridIdaho said:
Also I was told that running 4P panels to a combiner box makes them the same as series and one blocked, blocks them all.
Click to expand...
Not true, Combining them will add all currents and voltage will remain roughly the same. A shaded panel will lose very little voltage. The current is what is affected and in a series string the lowest current panel dictates the overall current.
 
littleharbor2 said:
Not true, Combining them will add all currents and voltage will remain roughly the same. A shaded panel will lose very little voltage. The current is what is affected and in a series string the lowest current panel dictates the overall current.
Click to expand...
UGH!
So yet another nail in the coffin for sig solar. They are the ones that told me that. Said the off grid eg4 inverter had 2 solar feed inputs and would keep me from losing power at a combiner box running my strings in P mode. Said 1 panel in a 4 panel P string would knock them all down just like series. Sheeessshhhhhh! They also told me the eg4 inverter would need a separate battery charger to charge batteries. When I asked why I couldnt use the built in battery charger they gave me a 5 minute convoluted smoke up my tail-pipe answer that made NO sense.

EG4 6.5KW OFF-GRID INVERTER​

The EG4 6500 EX-48 is a residential self consumption, multi-functional inverter/ charger, combining the capabilities of an inverter, MPPT solar charger, and a battery charger to offer uninterrupted power support in a single package. The comprehensive LCD display offers user configurable and easy-accessible button operation including: battery charging current, AC/Solar charger priority, and acceptable input voltage based on different applications.

  • Rated Power:6500W
  • Max PV Input:8000W
  • Battery Voltage:48V
  • Max Charging Current:120A
  • Max MPPT Operating Voltage:500VDC
  • Rated AC Output:120V

Thanks for giving me the straight scoop on that.

What about the 50/50 cells that have a panel on top and a panel on bottom. If a tree tip sweeps across the bottoms would the tops still feed power? I need to buy more panels so would that be a good choice? Monos or polys?
 
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OffGridIdaho said:
N idaho sun gets so low in winter 20ac and tall trees on neighbors land would still block you. Plus 20ac in coeur d alene would mean $20,000 a year in property taxes.
Click to expand...
20 acres here plus house is $3,000 a year in property taxes..

Be some mighty tall trees or some very low sun to block a panel 900 feet away.

Property is 900+ feet to a side. House is in Middle mostly clear cut buy logging operation before selling to us..
 
Never heard of anyone having cell balancing issues with SOK but several of us including me have had the issue with the EG4.

Most EG4 Lifepower owners do not know what is going on unless they hookup a computer to see the Cell voltages.
With the SOK and EG4LL it is right in front of you.

I have no idea about the brand of cells in the SOK. Maybe @HighTechLab will pass by and clarify.
 
8.5 acres property tax is $270 (goes to zero in 5 more years) nearest neighbor 1/8th mile other side of road
Biasjo said:
20 acres here plus house is $3,000 a year in property taxes..

Be some mighty tall trees or some very low sun to block a panel 900 feet away.

Property is 900+ feet to a side. House is in Middle mostly clear cut buy logging operation before selling to us..
Click to expand...
 
OffGridIdaho said:
They also told me the eg4 inverter would need a separate battery charger to charge batteries. When I asked why I couldnt use the built in battery charger they gave me a 5 minute convoluted smoke up my tail-pipe answer that made NO sense.
Click to expand...
Not the first time I have heard that sales tactic on here, they must have millions of them to get rid of LOL
 
Biasjo said:
20 acres here plus house is $3,000 a year in property taxes..

Be some mighty tall trees or some very low sun to block a panel 900 feet away.

Property is 900+ feet to a side. House is in Middle mostly clear cut buy logging operation before selling to us..
Click to expand...
35" angle high noon feb 1
 
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