diy solar

diy solar

Build a system in phases?

80sDweeb

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Feb 5, 2022
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I'm a beginner here. Been watching Will's videos for a year or more, but I don't have a little RV or tiny house, I've got a 3500 sq ft home, and I don't know how to get from zero to 100% solar. If I understand my electric bill right, my highest usage day is 66 kWh in July (obviously the AC.) I'm in northeast Arizona. Plenty of sun, gets up to about 100 on the hottest day, down around zero on the coldest night. I have a huge reefer trailer I'll be dropping onto the ground in my backyard which will house my solar, panels mounted on the top, batteries & inverter-controllers inside. What are options for building a solar system in phases? If I could build a system for everything except the AC, I could almost do it. But what good does a partial system do me? Can that even be done? If so, how?

Any good videos with ideas for this? Appreciate any suggestions and advice!
 
At the risk of sounding like Captain Obvious, the first thing to do is to see where you can reduce your energy usage without impacting your lifestyle. 66KWh is a lot of energy so if you can do things like install more insulation, get more efficient Air Conditioners, water heaters, etc it will make going 100% solar a bit easier and cheaper.

If you want to build in stages, it is important to have a 'final' design from the beginning so you are not buying stuff now that you will have to replace later.

Lets try and get a rough idea of the size of the system.

Solar Panels:
Right now the sweet spot in solar panels is the newer 450ish watt panels. Since you are in Arizona, I will assume you have a favorable insolation number of 5. With those assumptions, you will need (66000Wh/5 hours)/450W/panel = 30 panels to produce the daily 66KWh That is a fair number of panels but not an unreasonable number.

Most good MPPTs have a working voltage up to around 500V, but you need to leave some room for cold temperature voltage rise. Lets call it 450V. These newer 450W panels tend to have a high Voc of around 50V So you can have around 9 panels per string. With that in mind, let's assume two strings of 8 and two strings of 7 panels. You will probably need 4 MPPTs for that.... we would have to drill down on the numbers to see if some of the strings can be paralleled on a single MPPT. If you want to do more you could add a panel to each string.

The usage description does not include peak power, but I would guess it will be reasonably high in the summer. Let's assume at least 20KW.
That is most likely going to require a couple of inverters.

Battery storage should be at least 1 full day of power consumption.... 66KWh. Most residential large battery systems are in the 13-14KWh range, so you will need 5 or 6 of them.


Now let's spec out a system. I know the most about EG4 gear, but you could do this with many different brands

Solar Panels: The Blue Sun 460W from Signature Solar are a good buy. They are bi-facial so if you can ground mount them in a way that gets sun to the back you will get an extra boost above 460W.

Inverters: Two EG4 16Kpvs would probably do well. You would have 6 MPPTs and 24KW continuous capacity (And a surge capacity even higher).

Batteries: The EG4 Power Pro batteries are 14ish KWh so 5 of them would give 70KWh. Since you have a container to put them in, you can save a few dollars with the new Indoor model they just released.

Now we need to talk about how to phase things.

Solar panels: Buy a full string of panels at a time. Panels get replaced by new versions in a very short time and it is never good to mix panel types on an MPPT. Consequently, don't expect to add more panels to a string a few years down the line. You could start with a single string of 7, 8 or possibly 9 panels and add more strings as budget permits.

Inverters: This one is harder to predict. Inverter models tend to stay around longer but if you buy one now and can't buy a second one later it could be a problem. (Different models of inverters can not typically be run in parallel) I would tend to buy both inverters from the beginning, but I understand that can be a pain in the wallet.

Batteries: Ideally, all the batteries would be of the same model, but it is possible to parallel LiFePO4 batteries of different models as long as they have the same nominal voltage. Consequently, you can usually add battery capacity over time. The potential issue is that you might not be able to run all of them closed-loop with the inverter. (EG4 has their Coms Hub that lets you do some mix-n-match between older and newer battery models and still do closed-loop. I assume they will continue that pattern and support old versions along with newer versions)

Planning: (This is important) Figure out where everything will go and how it will be wired before you install anything. It is a real PITA if you have to move a component, run a larger conduit or even re-trench to your solar array when you expand. Planning ahead makes you far less likely to have to re-do the previous work.
 
At the risk of sounding like Captain Obvious, the first thing to do is to see where you can reduce your energy usage without impacting your lifestyle. 66KWh is a lot of energy so if you can do things like install more insulation, get more efficient Air Conditioners, water heaters, etc it will make going 100% solar a bit easier and cheaper.

If you want to build in stages, it is important to have a 'final' design from the beginning so you are not buying stuff now that you will have to replace later.

Lets try and get a rough idea of the size of the system.

Solar Panels:
Right now the sweet spot in solar panels is the newer 450ish watt panels. Since you are in Arizona, I will assume you have a favorable insolation number of 5. With those assumptions, you will need (66000Wh/5 hours)/450W/panel = 30 panels to produce the daily 66KWh That is a fair number of panels but not an unreasonable number.

Most good MPPTs have a working voltage up to around 500V, but you need to leave some room for cold temperature voltage rise. Lets call it 450V. These newer 450W panels tend to have a high Voc of around 50V So you can have around 9 panels per string. With that in mind, let's assume two strings of 8 and two strings of 7 panels. You will probably need 4 MPPTs for that.... we would have to drill down on the numbers to see if some of the strings can be paralleled on a single MPPT. If you want to do more you could add a panel to each string.

The usage description does not include peak power, but I would guess it will be reasonably high in the summer. Let's assume at least 20KW.
That is most likely going to require a couple of inverters.

Battery storage should be at least 1 full day of power consumption.... 66KWh. Most residential large battery systems are in the 13-14KWh range, so you will need 5 or 6 of them.


Now let's spec out a system. I know the most about EG4 gear, but you could do this with many different brands

Solar Panels: The Blue Sun 460W from Signature Solar are a good buy. They are bi-facial so if you can ground mount them in a way that gets sun to the back you will get an extra boost above 460W.

Inverters: Two EG4 16Kpvs would probably do well. You would have 6 MPPTs and 24KW continuous capacity (And a surge capacity even higher).

Batteries: The EG4 Power Pro batteries are 14ish KWh so 5 of them would give 70KWh. Since you have a container to put them in, you can save a few dollars with the new Indoor model they just released.

Now we need to talk about how to phase things.

Solar panels: Buy a full string of panels at a time. Panels get replaced by new versions in a very short time and it is never good to mix panel types on an MPPT. Consequently, don't expect to add more panels to a string a few years down the line. You could start with a single string of 7, 8 or possibly 9 panels and add more strings as budget permits.

Inverters: This one is harder to predict. Inverter models tend to stay around longer but if you buy one now and can't buy a second one later it could be a problem. (Different models of inverters can not typically be run in parallel) I would tend to buy both inverters from the beginning, but I understand that can be a pain in the wallet.

Batteries: Ideally, all the batteries would be of the same model, but it is possible to parallel LiFePO4 batteries of different models as long as they have the same nominal voltage. Consequently, you can usually add battery capacity over time. The potential issue is that you might not be able to run all of them closed-loop with the inverter. (EG4 has their Coms Hub that lets you do some mix-n-match between older and newer battery models and still do closed-loop. I assume they will continue that pattern and support old versions along with newer versions)

Planning: (This is important) Figure out where everything will go and how it will be wired before you install anything. It is a real PITA if you have to move a component, run a larger conduit or even re-trench to your solar array when you expand. Planning ahead makes you far less likely to have to re-do the previous work.
I am building a 600 sq ft off grid cabin for full time living in Arizona. I am having issues figuring out what size system I need considering I am a full time over the road long haul trucker and I have no power bill usage to reference. I will be building on rural bare land and will have to purchase all of my home appliances so I feel I will have more control building a solar system without having to fit it into existing appliances ect. Right now I'm looking at getting the EG4 6000XP all in one inverter with the indoor use power pro battery. Will that system be big enough to power my home full time with home office or will I need to double that with 2 6000xp inverter and 2 power pro batteries? Also how many solar panels will I need? I will have the normal appliances such as washer dryer standard kitchen appliances such as refrigerator, air fryer, blender, juicer ect and also a deep freezer. I will be powering starlink for internet and 2 Vizio Smart TV along with laptops iPad and cell phones Lazer printer, printer and copier for office use. I do plan on having 2 EG4 mini split 12000 BTU ac units.
 
I am building a 600 sq ft off grid cabin for full time living in Arizona. I am having issues figuring out what size system I need considering I am a full time over the road long haul trucker and I have no power bill usage to reference. I will be building on rural bare land and will have to purchase all of my home appliances so I feel I will have more control building a solar system without having to fit it into existing appliances ect. Right now I'm looking at getting the EG4 6000XP all in one inverter with the indoor use power pro battery.

I believe it is an excellent choice. My son just did the upgrade from 2 EG4 6500EX to 2 EG4 6000XP

Will that system be big enough to power my home full time with home office

I think one unit would work fine for your loads BUT design and build the 1st phase with the possibility of 2 or even 3 XPs, added later

update: start with 2 XPs with design to have 4 XPs, that would have 200 amp

or will I need to double that with 2 6000xp inverter and 2 power pro batteries?

if you have the money now, get the 2nd XP and yes, 2 power pro batteries. I have 70kwh of battery on my DIY system

Also how many solar panels will I need?

Like @FilterGuy stated, you can add 1 array string at a time. 2 XPs have 4 MPPTs, hence 4 arrays. Go for the max number of panels per array. Limited by the 450v and 17A max, 4000watts max per string, though you can put 5000watts per array for cloudy days. it will only use 4000watts on sunny days

I will have the normal appliances such as washer dryer standard kitchen appliances such as refrigerator, air fryer, blender, juicer ect and also a deep freezer. I will be powering starlink for internet and 2 Vizio Smart TV along with laptops iPad and cell phones Lazer printer, printer and copier for office use. I do plan on having 2 EG4 mini split 12000 BTU ac units.

go for 2 XPs, with room for a 3rd


the new tech today, represented by the EG4 products is so amazing compared to my first inverter from 24 years
much easier and cheaper to build a system today with what I call LEGO(r) solar parts
 
Last edited:
Roughly 1200kWh per month summer, likely half that winter.
Idk...
3500sqft in arizona, what conservation are you using?
Do you have any reflective surfaces outside bouncing the heat away?
 
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