That's great haha
LiTime is definitely dominating. They used to use other BMS, now they make everyone's BMS.
LiTime is definitely dominating. They used to use other BMS, now they make everyone's BMS.
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Prismatic versus pouch cells?
- Thread starter NEWYORKHILLBILLY
- Start date
I get your hesitation with pouch cells, especially if you're used to more traditional setups. Honestly, I was in the same boat until I stumbled upon PKCELL pouch cells. Last summer, during a camping trip with my buddies, my old batteries gave out unexpectedly. Luckily, a friend recommended trying PKCELL pouch cells, and they were a game-changer! They lasted longer and fit perfectly in our trailer setup. The flexibility in placement really came in handy.
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I have taico pouch cell battery and one cell has failed. When i tried to remove the defective one, i realized they tend to swell. Should i try pressurizing them to their original state?
Those belong in the trash. Discharge them to 0 volts first
Brucey
Solar Wizard
Were these sold to you as new or used?
Rednecktek
Solar Wizard
That's a SPICY pillow!! 
These were sold to me as new wall type by a Chinese company called Taico. They had supposed to have A grade 200ah brand new prizmatic cells. It (they) failed in first cycle. And when i opened it (after i understood they would not honor the warranty, at all) i saw these puffy pouch cells. Unfortunately i bought a full pallet of these. What people like Will doing is very valuable work. One can not be too careful with these battery scammers.
Yes, and they use these 45AH pouch cells(at least they did in my battery). How do they reach 100AH with 45AH pouch cells? Magic - that's how. Don't ask for internal pictures. They are patented.
But here is a QR code:
(the scanner doesn't have details on these cells, you'll have to trust me they are 45AH - everything, their capacity, qr code and type is stamped with ink that is easily cleaned away, no surprise they sell these as larger packs. )
However, once you accept these are in fact 90AH they do work at least until they swell. I'm a big fan of compressing lifepo4 cells. The typical way these are compressed in batteries is with reinforced tape (usually only two strips) and by being surrounded by hard foam.
If I was to use them I'd make sure they are properly compressed in my setup.
Brucey
Solar Wizard
I guess that explains why the Kepworth 12V 300Ah batteries go for so cheap.
Dave911
Solar Enthusiast
Im getting over 100ah out of two of my Moseworths, 97-98 out of two others.
They definitely have a BMS as I have tripped them on under voltage.
Maybe the Kepworth/Moseworths are not well made. All I know is that I have one 100ah that has been cycled daily since October. So for me they have been working fine. I would prefer prismatic cells, but if I can get 3000 cycles, Im not sure I care.
It would be really nice if Will would setup long term testing for some of these batteries.
Pictures, patented? I doubt that.
Is it possible that pouch cells will go bad if they are charged/discharged without some certain pressure? Perhaps that is why these lifepo4 manufacturers had taken the road to hard cases.
I can't say they are all like the one I had.
I also saw online tests where a guy runs a Kepworth at 1C and gets 103AH out of it. I don't think that is possible with 2p 45AH cells.
So if you're lucky you may get a good one.
If that is not it, than who knows? Perhaps Kepworth has reached a recognition point where others are cloning their name?
So for me they have been working fine. I would prefer prismatic cells, but if I can get 3000 cycles, Im not sure I care.
It would be really nice if Will would setup long term testing for some of these batteries.
I too think there is nothing wrong with pouch cells in principle, but I also think they are a lot less protected from random bumps and damage during the production process. If this is not noticed in QA you can end up with a bloated pillow of cells. I've damaged my fair share of pouch lipos to know how easy it is.
Also I think the metal (or plastic) shell in prismatic cells provides some little compression that is beneficial. It is s contentious topic, but I'm on the "compress" side.
Yes, exactly
grizzzman
Photon Vampire
- Joined
- Sep 21, 2019
- Messages
- 2,793
Why do you think that they put in aluminum and plastic containment ? Pouch cells need containment. I believe the bigger issue is as the cells AH's get larger the anode/cathode/jelly roll gets much larger, the expansion/contraction rate is much larger.
My humble opinion is; testing out a pouch cell out in the open would probably degrade or worse kill it.
These cells (lithium in general) are extremely water sensitive. As in, they degrade when air with moisture gets in.
How do I know it? I heard it, but also from limited self experience. I have been reworking the ends of a tiny 250mah 75C lipos for tiny fpv and I punctured the protective layer with tweezers making a tiny hole (in front of the cell pack, so electrodes were not touched). There was a drop of electrolyte. I sealed it with epoxy glue (these are expensive cells and you already keep them in fire proof case). I charged and discharged it fine, but a week later when I wanted to charge again it was dead.
So I chuckle when I hear about lithium cells with water based electrolyte. I'd love that. Lifepo is already very safe, but any flammable liquid next to parts that can get hot is not completely safe. So if we could have water based electrolytes that would be great. But I'm not holding my breath.
