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Adding DC-DC charger to 12V system, Can my alternator handle it?

dudedogvan

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  • 2004 Ford E150 camper van conversion
  • 115A alternator
I received a DC amp clamp in the mail to finally measure amperage on the B+ lead coming from my alternator. Measurements are:
  • At idle, with all possible loads drawing current (Max air conditioning front and rear units, bright headlights, and radio are all ON, starter battery charging): 60A
  • Revving engine to ~2000rpm, with all the same loads: 80A
Can my alternator handle adding in a 20A DC-DC charger to charge a 206ah LiFePO4 house battery? 30A charger? 40A charger?
 
I would stick with 20 amps. Input power could still be 25 to 30.
Does anyone out there feel like a 20A DC-DC charger would somehow be too much for the alternator with the other loads or is there nothing to worry about?
 
I don't. That's what I went with too - GM 8.1L 170A alternator.
That's what time2roll and smoothjoey recommended. The Victron Orion is really nice, works great. Excellent BT app.
 
I don't. That's what I went with too - GM 8.1L 170A alternator.
That's what time2roll and smoothjoey recommended. The Victron Orion is really nice, works great. Excellent BT app.
Right on, but to be fair your 170A alternator is rated for 55 more amps than mine... (your engine is also almost twice the size of my 4.6L too). There would be much less concern about whether you alternator could handle that extra load with the figures I've mentioned.
 
I don't. That's what I went with too - GM 8.1L 170A alternator.
That's what time2roll and smoothjoey recommended. The Victron Orion is really nice, works great. Excellent BT app.
Please don't speak for me.

His vehicle can use 70% of the alternator's rating before considering a dc2dc charger.
With the 20amp charger its quite possibly 96%.
I would like to see at least a 33.3% cushion.
 
Please don't speak for me.

His vehicle can 70% of the alternator's rating before considering a dc2dc charger.
With the 20amp charger its quite possibly 96%.
I would like to see at least a 33.3% cushion.
So you think it unwise to add a 20A DC-DC charger smoothJoey? When I took the readings, I had a hunch adding a 20A charger could be too much for the alternator, but I wanted to see what the forum had to say.
 
20 amp was the lowest option given. Could put a manual switch to stop for extreme conditions. But how often is all that equipment needed immediately? OK to keep some items off for the first 10 to 20 minutes for the chassis battery to get some charge. 10 amp would work perfectly fine, just slower. I still recommend the 20.

If by some slim chance the alternator quits.... AutoZone has a 130 amp available. Probably higher rated with more than a minimum search.
 
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  • At idle, with all possible loads drawing current (Max air conditioning front and rear units, bright headlights, and radio are all ON, starter battery charging): 60A
  • Revving engine to ~2000rpm, with all the same loads: 80A

It would be interesting to repeat the same test at the same rpm and drop a 20amp load- say headlights and see what the current reading is.

It could be the alternator is already peaking out at those RPMs in which case adding a 20amp extra load wont make a difference or not the full 20amp as expected to the current reading.

or is there nothing to worry about?

Temperature rather than amperage is usually the limiting factor in which case we should go with the manufactures maximum figure and downgrade that for extended life......same result....different reasons!
 
The DC clamp meter readings relate to the van loads and the starter battery charging, they don't indicate the maximum alternator output.
The numbers suggest a discharged or faulty starter battery.
I would fit the 20 amp b2b and consider a new starter battery.

Mike
 
  • 2004 Ford E150 camper van conversion
  • 115A alternator
I received a DC amp clamp in the mail to finally measure amperage on the B+ lead coming from my alternator. Measurements are:
  • At idle, with all possible loads drawing current (Max air conditioning front and rear units, bright headlights, and radio are all ON, starter battery charging): 60A
  • Revving engine to ~2000rpm, with all the same loads: 80A
Can my alternator handle adding in a 20A DC-DC charger to charge a 206ah LiFePO4 house battery? 30A charger? 40A charger?
Hold on, what was the time frame when this was measured? After the discharge during starting, it will take some time to recharge the starter battery so you might want to let the vehicle run for some time.

I find it hard to believe the vehicle used more amps at higher rpm unless something such as cooling fans were running (which need to be accounted for if equipped).

Now, having said all of that, I would not exceed 70 to 75% or alternator rated output. With 115A, it's already there at 80A.

Either add another alternator or a larger one. I have duals, 355A total.
 
Please don't speak for me.

His vehicle can use 70% of the alternator's rating before considering a dc2dc charger.
With the 20amp charger its quite possibly 96%.
I would like to see at least a 33.3% cushion.
You spoke for you, it was your recommendation to me. ?

You’re pretty sure he will burn out his alternator and I won’t? ?
 
20 amp was the lowest option given. Could put a manual switch to stop for extreme conditions. But how often is all that equipment needed immediately? OK to keep some items off for the first 10 to 20 minutes for the chassis battery to get some charge. 10 amp would work perfectly fine, just slower. I still recommend the 20.
That's a good point, I was thinking about adding a switch. Then I can use it when I'm not putting all those other loads on the alternator.
The DC clamp meter readings relate to the van loads and the starter battery charging, they don't indicate the maximum alternator output.
The numbers suggest a discharged or faulty starter battery.
I would fit the 20 amp b2b and consider a new starter battery.

Mike
That starter battery is only a couple months old.
It would be interesting to repeat the same test at the same rpm and drop a 20amp load- say headlights and see what the current reading is.

It could be the alternator is already peaking out at those RPMs in which case adding a 20amp extra load wont make a difference or not the full 20amp as expected to the current reading.
I took more readings with different components on and off, idling and at 2000rpm:

Idle:
  • battery positive lead: 8A
  • alternator (no loads): 15A
  • alternator (front A/C max cold): 43A
  • alternator (front & rear A/C max cold): 48A
  • alternator (headlights only): 22A
  • alternator (front & rear A/C max cold, headlights, radio): 65A
2000 rpm:
  • alternator (no loads): 16A
  • alternator (front & rear A/C max cold): 80A
  • alternator (front & rear A/C max cold, headlights, radio): 90A
-The readings are rough averages of a couple or a few readings. The amp clamp I bought is not a high quality fluke, just the best reviewed budget meter I found on Amazon.
Now, having said all of that, I would not exceed 70 to 75% or alternator rated output. With 115A, it's already there at 80A.

Either add another alternator or a larger one. I have duals, 355A total.
Based on more knowledgeable member's recommendations to leave ~30% load buffer on the alternator's amperage rating, I perceive the data as an indication that I need to either:
  • Increase my alternator's amperage capacity by either adding another alternator or installing a new alternator with more amperage capacity
OR
  • Have a switch for my DC-DC charger so I can turn it off when I'm using the A/C, because the A/C compressor draws the most current out of any load
Seems logical to me.
 
Why is there a difference in current between idle and 2000rpm with the same loads ?

Mike
 
Renogy said 40% is okay (sounds a bit much to me), but I am going with 25% of my 160A alternator. I can select 20 or 40 amps on the charger. The biggest draw I have now with everything running is 75A.
To avoid long-time running on idle and overheating, I want to install an illuminated on/off switch in the truck, but that makes installing the charger in the trailer close to the house battery less convenient. Would mean connecting/disconnecting a skinny, potentially breakable extra line every time I tow.
Mounting the charger at the truck rear would make for much easier switch installation. Wondering if a 6' run (instead of 2' or so) from the charger to the house battery be okay with 6AWG.
I prefer the second option in the pic, but I'd welcome your eminent opinions!
 

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I can't call it.
There are much better electrical minds than mine in this forum, but from what I have read, cooling is the big issue on high loads. At low RPM, the alternator does not see much air flow so there is a tendency to overheat.
Why is there a difference in current between idle and 2000rpm with the same loads ?

Mike
 
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Just had a similar discussion here. If the 60 % max constant load rule is applied, you'll end up with 115 * 0.6 = 70 A. Suppose normal use is 40 A, then 70 - 40 = 30 A seems maximum to me. Considering 115 A max minus 80 A max, that is in range too.
 
Why is there a difference in current between idle and 2000rpm with the same loads ?

Mike
There are much better electrical minds than mine in this forum, but from what I have read, cooling is the big issue on high loads. At low RPM, the alternator does not see much air flow so there is a tendency to overheat.
Yes, I have since found an explanation. At high rpm, the alternator generates more heat due to it's ~50% efficiency. More heat means it needs more fans for cooling, adding more load to the alternator to power the fans.
 
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