Please click the report link on the posts that are attempting disruption and I will warn and remove them.
Thanks.
Xuba Electronics: DEAL - 280AH LiFePo4 cells. Purchase & Review
- Thread starter Steve_S
- Start date
Thanks.
Hey folks, I'm deciding between the Xuba 280Ah cells and the 120AH's.
If anyone has experience with the 120's can you respond to my thread about them?
If anyone has experience with the 120's can you respond to my thread about them?
The sales staff are the ones informing us that these are EVE cells; I asked and they told me that.
[I'm not making any claims if they are or are not] but it's ABSOLUTELY indisputable (and thread relevant) that the seller is claiming that's what they are. For us to just say it's not on the spec sheet does not absolve them from this claim. Then we had the whole weirdness with EVE not wanting to respond to members asking to validate the stickers etc...
It's perfectly valid to raise claims of false advertising in this thread; even if it turns out to be incorrect. I can't understand why there has been hostility to our forum's detectives out there discovering stuff for us. To all of you researching this for me and others, thanks so much!
Also for the discoverer of this deal, thank you! For me, I'm gonna buy them anyway, BUT if I think there is false advertising going on I may buy half as many. So it's SUPER important to me if there is deception going on from the company.
So? How does previous ignorance on a procedure indicate invalid evidence being produced now?
Seems to me reducing someone's observations because they didn't know everything before is a real way to stifle information and sharing in a forum. I may think twice about asking for opinions if the climate here becomes one where I think it will be used against me in the future (the fact that I needed info on a procedure).
Excuse my ignorance, but I would have thought that a 9% variance in capacity on raw cells indicates a quality control problem. Lucky for you, you won (or your BMS is not calibrated right) someone else may not win. SO I'm really glad you shared that your cells are out of wack by 9% because that frankly scares me a bit about buying these.
@LukeVader sure seems concerned about the quality. But hay, maybe if we make the environment hostile enough to those raising concerns about their cells, fewer will report problems right? Especially if their past ignorance on topics is gonna be thrown at them for daring to question the pristine glory of these cells.
For me, possible seller deception is always important to know on big budget purposes. For all I know they have several different cells being wrapped up from different sources and they are just sending the best ones to the Americans and Canadians who they know will review on this forum, and me out here in Philippines am gonna get screwed (1st world companies often dump stuff that didn't pass QA standards out here in the 3rd world). The fact that your cells are so far out of spec is NOT good news for me. (Sorry to come down hard on you, just let's have free flow of information so the truth can come out - nothing personal, many of your posts have been very valuable to me). Thanks for the data you shared!
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Anyone sharing your experience about cells with the exact same little "authenticity sticker" as the Xuba cells please feel free to share your experience. Since Xuba did not manufacture these cells and the guys in Dunguan did not and they showed up at about the same time for sale... well.. if it walks like a duck, etc.
Maybe I'll file a -10% relevancy but if I were forced to bet all my worldly possessions, I'd bet they are from the same factory whoever that mysterious producer may be... once we have enough data and it turns out that only the "EVE" cells from other resellers are out of tolerance well then we'll know. As it stands now, only a small handful of people have posted their XUBA test resullts so the more the merrier if you have probably identical cells from another reseller. Please share people. I'm drooling waiting for more data to come in.
Maybe I'll file a -10% relevancy but if I were forced to bet all my worldly possessions, I'd bet they are from the same factory whoever that mysterious producer may be... once we have enough data and it turns out that only the "EVE" cells from other resellers are out of tolerance well then we'll know. As it stands now, only a small handful of people have posted their XUBA test resullts so the more the merrier if you have probably identical cells from another reseller. Please share people. I'm drooling waiting for more data to come in.
Sgt Raven
Solar Addict
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That would be fine, if the thread was about 280AH cells in general or with that sticker. This thread is about the 280AH cells sold by XUBA.
Steve_S
Offgrid Cabineer, N.E. Ontario, Canada
This is becoming TEDIOUS. I STARTED THIS THREAD and have regretted it at times.
Bottom Line: Amy @ XUBA has worked done things for OUR GROUP HERE because I have worked with her to improve the offerings and reliability of the shipping and even talked her into the free busbars & screws ad more... although I will not advocate for individuals, I tried tat a couple of times and got crapped on for it... I'm JUST A MEMBER HERE and have no affiliations to anyone, company or anything.
I have absolutely NO REASON to believe these are anything other than NEW CELLS and that they are most likely Grade-A. Amy told me they are but then again she may not know what the company manager arranged when they bought the bulk cells. Remember these people buy thousands at a time, XUBA is a low overhead operation with small "retail" list and keeping their costs low and passing that on.
I am the one who Contacted EVE Corporate with pictures of the QR Codes and they indeed VERIFIED THAT THESE WERE EVE Cells. They got upset because I posted a QUOTED COPY of the confirmation email. Note that apparently this pissed off competitor vendors who are selling the same at higher markup (I have seen as high as 300% markup).
SO FAR, with what tests I have done and am doing, they live up to spec and are exactly what they are. I was going to post extended info on such BUT I've shied away from it as it will seemingly cause more drama that I have no interest in. I will post some results when I feel up to it and have the time. May & June are VERY BUSY times for me with more important things. Trees to fell, logs to cut, firewood to prep and land to clear plus plantings to get in.
In Summary:
People have bought thousands of these from Xuba now.
99.8% are happy wit the end result.
They are EVE Cells but EVE has to play an odd role because of the competing vendors (you really need to understand Chinese business operations and how they work internally).
IF you still have doubts, then buy from another company, another brand like CALB, CATL, Winston, SinoPOLY and spend accordingly and stop complaining.
Bottom Line: Amy @ XUBA has worked done things for OUR GROUP HERE because I have worked with her to improve the offerings and reliability of the shipping and even talked her into the free busbars & screws ad more... although I will not advocate for individuals, I tried tat a couple of times and got crapped on for it... I'm JUST A MEMBER HERE and have no affiliations to anyone, company or anything.
I have absolutely NO REASON to believe these are anything other than NEW CELLS and that they are most likely Grade-A. Amy told me they are but then again she may not know what the company manager arranged when they bought the bulk cells. Remember these people buy thousands at a time, XUBA is a low overhead operation with small "retail" list and keeping their costs low and passing that on.
I am the one who Contacted EVE Corporate with pictures of the QR Codes and they indeed VERIFIED THAT THESE WERE EVE Cells. They got upset because I posted a QUOTED COPY of the confirmation email. Note that apparently this pissed off competitor vendors who are selling the same at higher markup (I have seen as high as 300% markup).
SO FAR, with what tests I have done and am doing, they live up to spec and are exactly what they are. I was going to post extended info on such BUT I've shied away from it as it will seemingly cause more drama that I have no interest in. I will post some results when I feel up to it and have the time. May & June are VERY BUSY times for me with more important things. Trees to fell, logs to cut, firewood to prep and land to clear plus plantings to get in.
In Summary:
People have bought thousands of these from Xuba now.
99.8% are happy wit the end result.
They are EVE Cells but EVE has to play an odd role because of the competing vendors (you really need to understand Chinese business operations and how they work internally).
IF you still have doubts, then buy from another company, another brand like CALB, CATL, Winston, SinoPOLY and spend accordingly and stop complaining.
Delta-V
Solar Enthusiast
- Joined
- Sep 20, 2019
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I'm in the middle of running another capacity test. Using all 16 Xuba cells this time (24V@560Ah). Rated capacity 14,336Wh. Started at 27V rested. Currently at 9,300Wh used in almost 24 hours so far. Hovering at about 26V now with a 500W load.
Hoping to reach 12,186Wh or more usable capacity (about 85%) for this test. A little less than 3kW to go. Should finish sometime today. I'll post my results after work today sometime.
Hoping to reach 12,186Wh or more usable capacity (about 85%) for this test. A little less than 3kW to go. Should finish sometime today. I'll post my results after work today sometime.
Sgt Raven
Solar Addict
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I apologize for adding to your regrets about this thread. Like most long threads on internet forums, they tend to wander and go off topic some after a certain size is reached. Most times they find their way back to on topic posts.
Some posters are using your frustration with EVE and their asking you to pull that post as proof of something wrong with the cells we are getting from XUBA.
Delta-V
Solar Enthusiast
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- Sep 20, 2019
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I'm losing track of which number capacity test this is, ha ha. Another desirable outcome.
16 Xuba 3.2V 280Ah LiFePO4 cells (8S2P, 24V nominal) - Rated capacity 14,336Wh
I disconnected both of the cheap 15A BMS's I had connected. No BMS's for this test. Not sure they've been doing much anyways as I've not been running any power through them. With now mostly new matched cells, looks like they're staying pretty well balanced on their own.
I used solar to charge the batteries this time. That's been a learning experience dinkin' around with the float & boost voltage settings then wrestling around with settling/ resting voltages (when I didn't necessarily want to fully charge the batteries). I combined the two 8-cell batteries this time to make one big battery. They balanced each other out to about 27V. I briefly used the BattGo Balancer to balance the 1st 8-cell battery to match the balancing with the 2nd battery.
I went with a 8S2P configuration (8-cell Series packs, 2 Paralleled together) instead of 2P8S (2 cells paralleled, 8 in Series) to make one big 24V battery. Inverter connected to opposite terminals (- on one pack, + on the other pack).
Test Range
Upper limit: 26.98V (rested voltage, inverter off)
Lower limits (varying low C-rate loads):
25.53V, 12,xxx Wh, 477 Ah = 85% usable capacity
25.26V, 13,000 Wh, 502 Ah = 90% usable capacity
24.80V, 13,xxx Wh, 534 Ah = 95% usable capacity
1st pic - Test Begins, Inverter on, showing all 3 voltage readings, just below 27V rested
2nd Pic - Met 85% Ah capacity goal (477 ÷ 560 = 85%), couldn't tell Wattage-wise as the meter apparently doesn't do decimal KWH. At least it's over 12,000 Watts. Still looking good at 25.53V
3rd Pic - I just saw it flip from 12 to 13KWH, voltage steady at 25.26V with over 600W load
502 ÷ 560 = 89% AH capacity
13,000 ÷ 14,336 = 90% Wh capacity
4th Pic - Below 25V, I shut everything off. Ended test, 534 ÷ 560 Ah = 95% usable capacity
5th Pic - Powered off inverter, battery bounced back to 25V after a few minutes rest
6th Pic - Overview of my state-of-the-art professionally built test system, ha ha
Result
From 27V to 25V range. In between the high & low ends of the typical LiFePO4 graph. Not bad.
I think I got better than expected output this time as I doubled the battery capacity compared to my previous tests but still used similar loads (half the already low C-rate, hence half the strain on each cell). Averaged around 390 Watts per hour.
After doing a number of capacity tests with these cells, they are performing as expected. I have no complaints.
My previous Xuba Cell Capacity Tests
1st Initial Full Capacity Test - 1st 8-cell battery, 1st test - 29 Mar 2020
2nd Full Capacity Test - 2nd 8-cell battery, 1st test - 2 Apr 2020
3rd Capacity Test - 1st 8-cell battery, 2nd test - 13 Apr 2020
4th Capacity Test - 2nd 8-cell battery, 2nd test - 18 Apr 2020
5th Capacity Test - 1st 8-cell battery, 3rd test - 20 Apr 2020
6th Capacity Test - 2nd 8-cell battery, 3rd test - 25 Apr 2020
7th Capacity Test - 2nd 8-cell battery, 4th test - 28 Apr 2020
8th Capacity Test - 16-cell battery, this test - 6 May 2020
16 Xuba 3.2V 280Ah LiFePO4 cells (8S2P, 24V nominal) - Rated capacity 14,336Wh
I disconnected both of the cheap 15A BMS's I had connected. No BMS's for this test. Not sure they've been doing much anyways as I've not been running any power through them. With now mostly new matched cells, looks like they're staying pretty well balanced on their own.
I used solar to charge the batteries this time. That's been a learning experience dinkin' around with the float & boost voltage settings then wrestling around with settling/ resting voltages (when I didn't necessarily want to fully charge the batteries). I combined the two 8-cell batteries this time to make one big battery. They balanced each other out to about 27V. I briefly used the BattGo Balancer to balance the 1st 8-cell battery to match the balancing with the 2nd battery.
I went with a 8S2P configuration (8-cell Series packs, 2 Paralleled together) instead of 2P8S (2 cells paralleled, 8 in Series) to make one big 24V battery. Inverter connected to opposite terminals (- on one pack, + on the other pack).
Test Range
Upper limit: 26.98V (rested voltage, inverter off)
Lower limits (varying low C-rate loads):
25.53V, 12,xxx Wh, 477 Ah = 85% usable capacity
25.26V, 13,000 Wh, 502 Ah = 90% usable capacity
24.80V, 13,xxx Wh, 534 Ah = 95% usable capacity
1st pic - Test Begins, Inverter on, showing all 3 voltage readings, just below 27V rested
2nd Pic - Met 85% Ah capacity goal (477 ÷ 560 = 85%), couldn't tell Wattage-wise as the meter apparently doesn't do decimal KWH. At least it's over 12,000 Watts. Still looking good at 25.53V
3rd Pic - I just saw it flip from 12 to 13KWH, voltage steady at 25.26V with over 600W load
502 ÷ 560 = 89% AH capacity
13,000 ÷ 14,336 = 90% Wh capacity
4th Pic - Below 25V, I shut everything off. Ended test, 534 ÷ 560 Ah = 95% usable capacity
5th Pic - Powered off inverter, battery bounced back to 25V after a few minutes rest
6th Pic - Overview of my state-of-the-art professionally built test system, ha ha
Result
From 27V to 25V range. In between the high & low ends of the typical LiFePO4 graph. Not bad.
I think I got better than expected output this time as I doubled the battery capacity compared to my previous tests but still used similar loads (half the already low C-rate, hence half the strain on each cell). Averaged around 390 Watts per hour.
After doing a number of capacity tests with these cells, they are performing as expected. I have no complaints.
My previous Xuba Cell Capacity Tests
1st Initial Full Capacity Test - 1st 8-cell battery, 1st test - 29 Mar 2020
2nd Full Capacity Test - 2nd 8-cell battery, 1st test - 2 Apr 2020
3rd Capacity Test - 1st 8-cell battery, 2nd test - 13 Apr 2020
4th Capacity Test - 2nd 8-cell battery, 2nd test - 18 Apr 2020
5th Capacity Test - 1st 8-cell battery, 3rd test - 20 Apr 2020
6th Capacity Test - 2nd 8-cell battery, 3rd test - 25 Apr 2020
7th Capacity Test - 2nd 8-cell battery, 4th test - 28 Apr 2020
8th Capacity Test - 16-cell battery, this test - 6 May 2020
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I think you missed the post addressing that these are likely the identical cells.
So sounds totally reasonable @LukeVader 's hypothesis that they may be Eve cells that didn't meet spec. for some reason (which follows with @Sgt Raven 's getting out of spec results in his tests). That seems to be the best explanation to fit the data we have.
Our lockdown here ends (supposedly) in another week and I'm gonna buy some. I just hope I get cells like Sgt. Raven got!
I will be a HAPPY camper with 308 AH capacity. Please everyone keep reporting your findings without fear of data repression.
More data is better on these identical EVE 280's being sold by Xuba and a couple other vendors. I hope you won't be afraid to post here so we don't have to search multiple threads for the handful of people who are sharing capacity tests. Thanks everyone.
Sgt Raven
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I think you missed the point that this thread is about these cells sold by one seller, XUBA.
Sgt Raven
Solar Addict
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What out of specs results? My cells preformed exactly like I would expect brand new cells to preform. They gave me about 10% above their rating, which is quite common for a newly built battery. Will has even said the same about some of the batteries he built for videos.
I think you missed the point that if Walmart sells some new kind of Duracell batteries, and K-mart sells them too, and I buy them at Walmart; it's absolutely germane to mention the identical product someone bought at K-mart. Are you like a shareholder in Xuba or something?
I just don't understand all the negative emotion. We are consumers, the excess/offloaded EVE cells are a product. Why do we have to repress information, we aren't actually in China you know.
heirloom hamlet
life my way
I have 32 of these cells due to arrive shortly. I will have one 24v set up like your most recent test (8S2P) and two others like your former tests (8 in Series). I really appreciate all of your data recording and time posting these tests in the forum. Question... Is there a particular top, bottom setting that you are using now...that you seem to prefer after all this, for your usage? It sounds like your office items usage is just about the pull we'll be putting on ours.
heirloom hamlet
life my way
I wasn't required to show any form of ID. Amy just ran it and it went through fine.
heirloom hamlet
life my way
Let's choose unity and kindness guys. Often times, it's just a tone or phrase choice that changes a good vibe to aggressive. The world has more than enough of that already. We are all interested in solar energy...that is, we want to behave differently to and healthier to our environment, than the majority. Let's be alert to do the same in our participation in this environment. I'm not reprimanding in saying any of this, not at all, just giving a reminder. Lord knows I need them all the time. Choose respect and kindness.
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Exactly, let's stop scape-goating people in this thread for just reporting their findings. The more data the merrier; it's silly to make it personal. Finding possible issues with a product is not attacking those who found the deal or already bought it. Xuba is a company, not a cult. I think...
Delta-V
Solar Enthusiast
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I'm still trying to figure out the particular top and bottom settings. The 27V - 25V range worked out really well in this last test. Seems like a nice Goldilocks range. But, it required regular attention as I had to set the solar charge controller (SCC) above 28V to maximize the amps (current) to charge the battery in a reasonable amount of time. So I was frequently checking and adjusting the SCC settings to finally get to a resting 27V.
When I'd simply set the SCC to 27V, the bulk charge would end too soon (about 1/3 charged), leaving the absorb phase to charge the remaining 2/3 capacity. I estimated It'd take several days to finish charging before finally settling at 27V. Plus, it would waste a lot of good Sun hours (power potential) at reduced charging. Guess it's one of the problems with using a SCC that wasn't designed for charging LFP batteries. I don't know, even with my Samlex inverter/ charger using the Lithium CC/ CV charging option would take a long time to get that last 5% - 10% capacity to get to 27V.
I'm considering what Will said in this post: DIY LiFePo4 Solar Battery
Of course, he also has the sticky post: Recommended Charge Profile for DIY LiFePO4 Batteries *Sticky Post*
Now that I have a good sense-of-confidence the batteries are working as expected. I'll do a little more researching/ experimenting/ fine-tuning and settle on some reasonably care-free settings.
Some things I've recently learned are differences in voltage under various loads vs no-load and settling voltages, both when charging and discharging. Typically need to charge higher with the expectation the voltage will drop some (assuming you're able to let the battery settle/ rest). When discharging, you can go lower than the lower limit you set, knowing the voltage will bounce back some as well (again, if you're able to let the battery rest). So there is some offset estimation. Especially, when setting the inverter low-voltage alarm and cut-off.
I expect the experience will differ when I start continuously using the battery (always under some kind of load). Likely having to estimate some compensation or fine-tuning based on my average usage.
Having some sort of capacity monitor has been very helpful. The Drok meter I've been using shows the total accumulated Ah and Wh used. It also goes in reverse when charging. So, I can see how quickly it's charging back up and when it should be about finished, going back to a zero reading.
For me, with regular daily usage, I think it'll be rare that I'll come close to using 85% potential capacity a day (~12kWh). Probably be around half that. Some days I'll hardly use it at all, other days, I may get a couple days of crumby weather (using solar charging) where the battery will be fully utilized. Heck, it took me about 1.5 days to do my last capacity test and it was powering about 95% of my 120V power usage, even when I'm working from home. Plus, it'll be a nice-to-have if/ when I go 5+ days without grid power again during hurricane seasons.
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