A-grade 304 Eve cells - fake, or real? What to expect?

[Alkaline]

Capacity does not matter, cells staying balance matters far more, not having to break apart your pack and bringing them back up matters. Having cells that aren't runners and dippers far more.

I'll trade capacity to cells working in unison any day of the week. Having built both grade A and B, I know B requires extra care, balancers and will still require the potential to replace 1-2 cells to get the pack working optimally.

You can reduce a lot of these issues with an active balancer and routinely charging to 100%.

Capacity can give you a false sense of quality, because you are judging each cell on its own and not how its going to work in a pack with other cells.

 

[Alkaline]

According to pics on the 18650 store theres both round like pictured here and the hexagon cells out there..

LF304 and LF280K v1/V2 have round terminals
LF280k v3 has hexagon terminals
LF306K (unreleased) will have hexagon terminals
LF560K (unreleased) will have hexagon terminals

No LF304 has had hexagon terminals.

 

[wfdTamar]

I don’t see any cells with octagonal terminal bases on the 18650 store. (ah, I wasn't seeing under the welded on posts).

What is your source for that (previous post) info Alkaline?

There was the K in marker pen under the top label.

 

[hwy17]

I don’t see any cells with octagonal terminal bases on the 18650 store.

It's this listing:

PRESALE (Version 3) - EVE LF280K Grade A Cells - LiFePO4 Battery

*NOTE*This is a special presale price. Product expected to ship ~NOV 20, 2023 from our warehouse in Atlanta, GA. Now with 8,000 cycle life and testing much higher than 280Ah, most all test above 300Ah. Cells include the double hole terminal block welded factory direct by EVE and Flexible...

www.18650batterystore.com

 

[Alkaline]

https://www.18650batterystore.com/cdn/shop/files/image_2023_09_25T08_01_31_868Z_700x.png?v=1695629686

Only 280K V3 has octagon terminals.


Grade B 280K V3 tests so high that scammers inevitably are re-lasering them as 304, we suspect this would happen and now it has.

You can contact EVE yourself on Alibaba:

Eve Power Co., Ltd.

Eve Power Co., Ltd., Experts in Manufacturing and Exporting and 0 more Products.

evebatteryhb.en.alibaba.com

Shot of our convo.


NOW GET TO CLEANING that terminal it will take a while, go slow and wipe away. Once you do then you tell the Australian vendor you want 50% of your money back.

 

[Alkaline]

Here is an example of real qr code:

New Docan 230Ah EVE Cells

Sorry you feel this way, but I suspect many others feel the same, I'm just disappointed at how effectively the Chinese sellers have spread misinformation to the point the average joe has no idea what is what. ? Ok, I'm always anxious to learn more. So if you know what the Chinese sellers are...

diysolarforum.com

notice no difference in qr code background or to the edges, also if you look close the QR code looks like it was done with some type of DOT matrix style laser engraver, its not straight.

 

[wfdTamar]

Ok, I tried reasoning with the seller and asked for cell test reports and explanations of the octagonal terminal bases. I explained that it is likely their supplier pulling a fast one - that I didn't blame them, but I wanted some proof. He turned nasty pretty much straight away and did the 'I know what I'm selling, take my word for it' routine. This is a seller that mainly sells beads and other trinkets, reasonable 96% feedback over a few years. Just to warn others in Australia the seller is goodstuffhere*au in Rockhampton, Queensland.

I reported it to ebay as a counterfeit item and that they had loads more to sell (20 lots of 4 cells). That perked their interest up a lot more as initially they thought it was just the ones I had bought. Really annoying as I wanted to get into building it. I may have been ok with these cells if they had been honest and cooperative with some cash adjustment.

 

[Crowz]

Ok, I tried reasoning with the seller and asked for cell test reports and explanations of the octagonal terminal bases. I explained that it is likely their supplier pulling a fast one - that I didn't blame them, but I wanted some proof. He turned nasty pretty much straight away and did the 'I know what I'm selling, take my word for it' routine. This is a seller that mainly sells beads and other trinkets, reasonable 96% feedback over a few years. Just to warn others in Australia the seller is goodstuffhere*au in Rockhampton, Queensland.

I reported it to ebay as a counterfeit item and that they had loads more to sell (20 lots of 4 cells). That perked their interest up a lot more as initially they thought it was just the ones I had bought. Really annoying as I wanted to get into building it. I may have been ok with these cells if they had been honest and cooperative with some cash adjustment.

They still may reach out to you since you informed ebay about it.

 

[Alkaline]

Ok, I tried reasoning with the seller and asked for cell test reports and explanations of the octagonal terminal bases. I explained that it is likely their supplier pulling a fast one - that I didn't blame them, but I wanted some proof. He turned nasty pretty much straight away and did the 'I know what I'm selling, take my word for it' routine. This is a seller that mainly sells beads and other trinkets, reasonable 96% feedback over a few years. Just to warn others in Australia the seller is goodstuffhere*au in Rockhampton, Queensland.

I reported it to ebay as a counterfeit item and that they had loads more to sell (20 lots of 4 cells). That perked their interest up a lot more as initially they thought it was just the ones I had bought. Really annoying as I wanted to get into building it. I may have been ok with these cells if they had been honest and cooperative with some cash adjustment.

if there are 100 people selling cells, 5% are selling legit 95% are selling fraud. Its because you have to buy in such large quantity to get the price down low enough for real grade A that 95% of the potential sellers simply don't have the capital.

You still have not cleaned up the QR code, you need to do it, I'll add your thread to my cuationary list. While it may not do much 1 out of 10 people buying ebay/amazon/ali may stumble across the thread and not get scammed.

Once you clean the qr code area and up to the edges of the cell you'll clearly see if its been sanded or not.

 

[wfdTamar]

I’ve put the top label back in place I’m not sure I want to disturb it in case it’s grounds for reducing the refund. I’ll have a look and see if it (or another cell) come up ok again.

 

[wfdTamar]

Wondering, as I want the option to be able to run high power 240 volt appliances (3000 watt inverter), wether going for a 12 volt 8 cell setup might not be more sensible so as to lower the load on each cell as the quality of the cells (particularly at high Amp draw) is questionable?

 

[Sam Cho TX]

Is this confirmed that the new LF304 does not have hexagon terminals and is still round?
If it is then clearly these 304 are phony.

 

[wfdTamar]

Hexagon is 6. Octagon is 8. They’re octagon!

Alkaline has said in discussion with Eve that the only cells with octagons currently sold are 280K v. 3 (a cell that can actually be as high as 304) and that the new version of 304 will have octagons, but they are not on the market yet.

The cells I bought according to the (suspect) QR codes were manufactured in May/June ‘23. Am I the first person to have bought the new Eve 304 v.3 with octagonal terminals for A1079 (US$692))?

You’d think if that were the case the seller would be willing to prove it.

All signs are they are 280K v.3 (octagons, even a K in marker under the label, but I’m not sure if that’s what the marker means). Seller assures me they will test at 304Ah, so maybe good Grade B 280k? Which may not be a bad buy at that price, but I can’t abide the deception.

 

[Alkaline]

304 will be replaced by a new cell called 306K, this will have the octagons, LF304 has no plans on going octagon.

The LF306K will be rated for the 6000 cycles , current LF304 is rated for 3500 cycles.

K = long cycle life.

 

[wfdTamar]

Tested one cell with an EBC-A20 tester. Charged, then discharged. 308.5Ah, so if they're all like that, decent capacity. Frustrating - if the seller had correctly labelled and titled the sale, they'd still be an ok buy at that price.

 

[Alkaline]

Yes the 280K V3 is kick butt cell, You can see it can easily pass for a 304 and most will never question it.

 

[augiedoggy]

Yes the 280K V3 is kick butt cell, You can see it can easily pass for a 304 and most will never question it.

Curious/ whats the weight difference between a legit 304 cell and a 280? do you know?

 

[wfdTamar]

From Evemall site -
5490 grams ±300g
5450 grams ±164g

So can't use that to tell.

 

[wfdTamar]

Oh BTW, for Australian buyers that seller has two usernames on ebay selling these cells:
goodstuffhere*au
richonline1249

You can decide for yourselves if what he's selling is legitimate based on discussion here. I certainly wouldn't say they're bad cells, but they're not what is stated.

Even though there is no official standard for the term, 'Grade-A' implies the best, possibly only exceeded by 'certified automotive' or 'certified storage' (I've seen mention of both these). Grade-B are definitely those that have not met those two standards, but still may be ok for some uses. There is greater risk of getting a lower capacity or even dud cell with Grade-B - therefore the prices are lower. Some of these would be the ones being rebadged as 'Grade-A' which should be considered counterfeit.

What is really frustrating is there seems no way of trusting anything any seller states. Even those in your own country from seemingly legitimate companies. It just might be easier to get a refund if they are local.

 

[Supermo26]

All this makes it difficult to want to purchase cells.