Before you go 48v on your camper or install a minisplit...

[hour]

I've been toying with the idea of stepping up to a higher voltage on my new camper right out of the gate. This would involve sacrificing a bunch of perfectly usable brand new gear and replacing it. I don't even know how many thousands I would have spent doing this.

The reason was really just to run the air conditioner. So this might not be the solution for people who wish to microwave/air condition/make coffee simultaneously, but I'll be buying one immediately once they're available and selling the unused Coleman off my roof for whatever I can get. I'm guessing this will go for over $2k but I would have blown somewhere around that on just a MultiPlus anyway. My end result still would have been a clunky, noisy, on/off air conditioner. Thank goodness for late night youtubing to avoid sleep

 

[corn18]

Looks cool but not sure it saves much other than a soft start. He said 14A running which is 1680W (my 15kBTU old fashioned ac is 1350W running). You can throttle the compressor down to 7A running which is 840W. Little misleading to say it works on a 1kW inverter. It will, but at 50% compressor which means 50% less cooling.

Love the quietness of it, though. I added KoolRV ducts and WackO silencers and I'm pretty happy with the improved flow and quietness of my dinosaur units. I would want these new ones if I bought a new RV but won't replace what I have.

 

[G8trwood]

How about a variable speed quiet compressor model to mount under the trailer . Something better for mice to nest in.

 

[justinm001]

Not sure what this has anything to do with 48v or not needing an inverter. It's still 120v and still uses a bunch of power.

It's great they finally made it 5 years later but it's only 20% or so more efficient and just solves not buying an easy start.

Sucks it's non ducted only and uses a remote so doubt it's smart and likely can't be.

I like my dometics with the ccc2 and using microair thermostat to control all 4 of them. I have 2 furrion chill 15.5k too and don't like them nearly as much.

 

[corn18]

They said they are going to make a ducted version.

I love my MicroAir thermostats, too. I put one on each ac unit because my dinosaur Colemans wouldn't do dual zone. At least not that I could figure out. We like the bedroom a bit cooler than the main space at night.

 

[justinm001]

They said they are going to make a ducted version.

I love my MicroAir thermostats, too. I put one on each ac unit because my dinosaur Colemans wouldn't do dual zone. At least not that I could figure out. We like the bedroom a bit cooler than the main space at night.

Sweet must have missed that part. I love my microair too. Right now I have 2 Furrion Chill 15.5ks, 2 Dometic Brisk2s, and 2 original Dometic penguins. The dometics are on 2 thermostats but I have another brisk2 i forgot about in my driveway (upside down so hope it still works), and hopefully Saturday I'll pickup a new freshjet at an auction. I also have 2 colemans in my warehouse.

Since I have 6 ACs for whatever reason I figured having various sizes and types is ideal, espically since Dometic will let me multizone 4 together on a single thermostat. I'm also redoing my ceiling so they'll all be ducted together and hopefully I can figure out how to make it so I can run the front to cool the middle and middle to cool rear and such so they're completely silent.

One of my old ACs began leaking a bit and randomly turning on even though set off. Once i get the ACs replaced I can do the ceiling and finish my Solar project now its warming up.

 

[hour]

Not sure what this has anything to do with 48v or not needing an inverter. It's still 120v and still uses a bunch of power.

It's great they finally made it 5 years later but it's only 20% or so more efficient and just solves not buying an easy start.

Sucks it's non ducted only and uses a remote so doubt it's smart and likely can't be.

I like my dometics with the ccc2 and using microair thermostat to control all 4 of them. I have 2 furrion chill 15.5k too and don't like them nearly as much.

Okay, well the overwhelming majority of travel trailers come with 12v systems. Many people want to know what it will take to run their air conditioner and the answer (in addition to storage capacity) is often 24/48v and/or generator. Having just wrapped up many weeks of browsing and finally selecting a camper, I can tell you most are coming with pure sine wave inverters with AC pass through. 2000w in my case. Good equipment worth keeping.

If the main objective with 120v is to run the air conditioner (true in my case) this could be a huge win. I could spend a lot of time and money going to 48v and accomplish the goal. I could install a multiplus 12|3000 and a soft start and still be hammering 12v. I could install a transfer switch and cinder block sized inverter and also still be hammering 12v. This would allow me to focus solely on storage and solar. Not upgrading my generator, not replacing good components.

I think it solves a lot more than you're giving it credit for. No generator ramping up and down from 0-100 in harmony with the noise of the compressor kicking on. No inverter fan going from 100rpm to 2,000. Better temperature consistency, better humidity control, better sleep? I could go on. Think you may be off on your efficiency gain #'s too. Not sure what real world 24hr consumption would look like side by side.

This isn't some silver bullet for everyone lol. I just know the "AC on my camper when boondocking" is a common question, and the answer will get simpler as these become more common, from Furrion or whoever else decides to up their game.

 

[justinm001]

Okay, well the overwhelming majority of travel trailers come with 12v systems. Many people want to know what it will take to run their air conditioner and the answer (in addition to storage capacity) is often 24/48v and/or generator. Having just wrapped up many weeks of browsing and finally selecting a camper, I can tell you many are coming with pure sine wave inverters with AC pass through. 2000w in my case. Good equipment worth keeping.

If the main objective with 120v is to run the air conditioner (true in my case) this could be a huge win. I could spend a lot of time and money going to 48v and accomplish the goal. I could install a multiplus 12|3000 and a soft start and still be hammering 12v. I could install a transfer switch and cinder block sized inverter and also still be hammering 12v. This would allow me to focus solely on storage and solar. Not upgrading my generator, not replacing good components.

I think it solves a lot more than you're giving it credit for. No generator ramping up and down from 0-100 in harmony with the noise of the compressor kicking on. No inverter fan going from 100rpm to 2,000. Better temperature consistency, better humidity control, better sleep? I could go on. Think you may be off on your efficiency gain #'s too.

I'm confused on why this has any impact on 48v vs 12v. There's only a slight increase in efficiency so the only difference is the compressor startup amps (LRA) With an easy start this is minimized and most inverters have a surge. So running this AC at 1300w vs a normal one at 1500w isn't a huge difference.

You pick 12/24/48v inverter systems usually because of the amount of power you're running through it. Running 1500w through 12v is only 125a so easy to run 4/0 cable and call it a day. If you're wanting to run 3000w+ then 24/48 starts to make more sense. But the real cost benefit is those with large solar as the MPPTs can handle 4x the thruput with 48v over 12v.

The compressor kicking in is a split second thing and shouldn't have an effect on an inverter fan.

I totally get the temp consistency, humidity and all that. Its great for that but shouldn't have an impact if you're wanting to go 12/24/48 based on 10% increased efficiency.

 

[Lt.Dan]

I don't see the purpose either. Its a step in the right direction for sure, but it is not more efficient. The guy says 40% more efficient and thats a load of .

My other concern is more than 1 unit. I know a lot of RV's out there only have 1 AC unit, if they are 25'ish and smaller, but a lot are coming with 2, and some (like my 5th wheel) come with 3! My onboard Onan 5500 generator was able to run all 3 AC's at once because the entire brain of the RV could control when the compressors cycled on/off, and just prevented 2 from starting at the same time, allowing all 3 to run on 5500w no problem. Once you get to 2 units, then running off a 12v inverter is simply stupid, and if you are already stepping up in voltage, then leaving the original Coleman, Dometic, or Furion make the most sense. So in my opinion, this unit serves a very small group of people with small RV's that want to run off of a small 2000w Honda Generator.

When I lived in my RV, the noise didn't bother me much anyways. I had 3x Coleman 15k's, with the RV Airflow ducting, and yeah you could hear it on, but I never was yelling at someone because we couldn't talk over it.

I tend to notice people overthinking stepping up to 24v or 48v in their 12v RV. Its not as difficult as it may seem.

 

[corn18]

I actually really like what they are doing. All of the plusses are appealing to me. Just don't buy one thinking it needs a smaller system to run. 1680W is a lot of juice. Not many folks want to run an ac on batteries once they find out how much a system capable of doing that costs. 12/24/48 volts is not relevant.

I will wait and see what the reports are on the half power operation. If it translates to 9k BTU @ 7 amps, that would be really, really awesome.

 

[hour]

I tend to notice people overthinking stepping up to 24v or 48v in their 12v RV. Its not as difficult as it may seem.

I mean if it were just adding 48v of batteries it'd be NBD. But there goes your factory installed charge controller (oh no!), and now you have to use a boost controller to deal with the 1-2 panels preinstalled on the roofs of most RVs or rethink your solar entirely. Factory inverter gone. Factory converter/charger gone. The "7 pin is wimpy but it'll keep your new DC fridge going while driving" gone.

That's several expensive and kind of pain in the ass things to address before you can call the job done. If it were all the same garbage of the past it'd likely be easier to justify, but lithium ready charger/converter, pure sine wave inverter, 200 watt panels from factory... it's not so easy to let go of (or have to completely flip on its head) at least in my case.

If it translates to 9k BTU @ 7 amps, that would be really, really awesome.

Did he say that in the video - the 7 amps? I may have also read it in the PDF manual for the ac.

 

[corn18]

I mean if it were just adding 48v of batteries it'd be NBD. But there goes your factory installed charge controller (oh no!), and now you have to use a boost controller to deal with the 1-2 panels preinstalled on the roofs of most RVs or rethink your solar entirely. Factory inverter gone. Factory converter/charger gone. The "7 pin is wimpy but it'll keep your new DC fridge going while driving" gone.

That's several expensive and kind of pain in the ass things to address before you can call the job done. If it were all the same garbage of the past it'd likely be easier to justify, but lithium ready charger/converter, pure sine wave inverter, 200 watt panels from factory... it's not so easy to let go of (or have to completely flip on its head) at least in my case.

Did he say that in the video - the 7 amps? I may have also read it in the PDF manual for the ac.

I think so. Not gonna watch it again but I do recall hearing that when he set it to 50% and it made me perk up. Just need to know the BTU's @ 7A. He didn't say how the BTU's ramped with compressor selection.

 

[justinm001]

I mean if it were just adding 48v of batteries it'd be NBD. But there goes your factory installed charge controller (oh no!), and now you have to use a boost controller to deal with the 1-2 panels preinstalled on the roofs of most RVs or rethink your solar entirely. Factory inverter gone. Factory converter/charger gone. The "7 pin is wimpy but it'll keep your new DC fridge going while driving" gone.

That's several expensive and kind of pain in the ass things to address before you can call the job done. If it were all the same garbage of the past it'd likely be easier to justify, but lithium ready charger/converter, pure sine wave inverter, 200 watt panels from factory... it's not so easy to let go of (or have to completely flip on its head) at least in my case.

Did he say that in the video - the 7 amps? I may have also read it in the PDF manual for the ac.

Thats all because RV manufacturers are 5+ years behind the times and using inferior products. Almost all Prevost coaches use 24V inverter systems from the factory, Some might be 48v (Liberty uses Volta systems).

In a few years we'll be seeing more RVs start with 48v because its cheaper and proven.

Also lets all remember this is Lippert talking and most of their products are inferior, over promised and under delivered. I have 2 of their chills which state they have smartstart built-in but in reality my Dometic's use less startup amps. Notice how they Sales VP was talking and not the VP of Engineering. I sit in a lot of corporate meetings and the person who's explaining the specs matter.