Existing Cabin Panel

[seneysolar]

I'll have to check in inrush of my pump when I open camp in the spring. I vaguely remember it pulling over 12 amps running. Having everything Victron would be kind of cool if I ever moved the setup to civilization and could use the interfacing options.



From your name, I'm guessing you are near the refuge? I'm down by the Garden peninsula. Neighbor camp had a picture of a moose that must have originated

Yep Seney. I travel all over the place. If you ever need any help, message me and ill stop by.

 

[orionrising]

I would be tempted to use the existing well pump to fill a plumbed in IBC tote, then a car battery, a 12v charger and 12v pump to actually pressurize the cabin. I live offgrid with a IBC tote filled from jugs, a car battery and 12v pump and its works great. Cheap too.

 

[12VoltInstalls]

I would be tempted to use the existing well pump to fill a plumbed in IBC tote, then a car battery, a 12v charger and 12v pump to actually pressurize the cabin. I live offgrid with a IBC tote filled from jugs, a car battery and 12v pump and its works great. Cheap too.

That’s basically what I do during the non-freezing season.

It’s had ancillary benefits a couple of times as I could go elsewhere with the tote on a trailer and get water 2000lbs at a time.

The ‘tank’ actually helped re-destination my life. 2017ish i started a journey to independence, by ‘19 I had rented a secluded lot for $35/month with no water or power, bought my first solar, and bought the tote to bring in water for my ‘stationary rv’ situation.
Bettered my circumstances a couple times with the money saved and now have moved to property I bought with money I didn’t have to spend.

The tote on a trailer enabled water without constant jugs and planning; running water for a shower once or twice a day let’s you be/live “normal” and keep a professional job without ‘feeling’ the consequences of sacrifices you made to change the future as well as maintaining ‘appearances’ necessary to keep a real job. “Homeless expenses” without being homeless or otherwise vulnerable.

Those 275-gal totes have so many uses offgrid. On the rented lot I collected enough rainwater to not have to go get water for months on end on that rented property once I thought of it. And when I build my garage this summer I’m going to put some “big ones” under the floor- insulated- to store “waste heated” water for heating. If one needs to collect gray water they are useful, too. And if you need portable pressure washing they’re great for that, as well as garden watering instead of 500’ of hoses.

Those totes are so useful!

For the OP’s camp that is a great idea.

 

[orionrising]

also, I have a normal light switch wired into the pump power by the sink. flick it on when you need water. only downside is forgetting to switch it back off at times, i keep meaning to wire a warning light into it.

 

[indaUPeh]

Finally got camp opened up. Inrush for the pump is just shy of 32A. Lasts one second. Then she runs 10.6 to 11.6 for around a minute. My generator supplies 119.6V under no load and was at 112V when the pump was on.

Looked on currentconnected.com at a multiplus 24/3000 which appeared to have a 5kva peak. When I emailed about the duration of that figure the representative said 10 seconds and that itn ould not power my load. A little confused as to why.

Would I be breaking any hard and fast rules where you factor in some type of precentage I don't know about?

Thanks

 

[littleharbor2]

I would stay away from the "all in one" units. Youll want to switch it off when you leave, but then the solar is also off... . If you switch off an all in one unit and you have say 50% batteries, you return to 50% next weekend, not ideal.

Having a stand alone charge controller recovers and keeps your batteries full when youre gone while the inverter is off. Then you start your next weekend on full charge.

Maybe someone knows of one that keeps solar on? Otherwise a traditional LF inverter charger with separate mppt would serve you well.

Im a fan of Aims products for off grid cabins on a budget but im a tad biased on that. Victron and Outback are top choices as well (just pricey) and will last for years.

The Midnite MN 3024DIY keeps charging when the inverter is shut down. The higher max Voc models don't

 

[seneysolar]

The Midnite MN 3024DIY keeps charging when the inverter is shut down. The higher max Voc models don't

The Midnite Diy 3024 is a high freq SRNE inverter. Good units but its not going to like that pump startup.

 

[littleharbor2]

The Midnite Diy 3024 is a high freq SRNE inverter. Good units but its not going to like that pump startup.

The heaviest load I've seen them power is a tablesaw. It had no problem with that but, as we know, some well pumps are notorious for big starting surges

 

[Mattb4]

I run my 1/2hp shallow well water pump with my equivalent (Re badged SRNE 3kW AIO) all the time with out issue. The pumps label list SFA at 10.8a During operation it seems to pull between 700-800a with a brief startup surge of just under 2800w (23a). It is not a bad load and I have seen my inverter handle starting the pump even with my microwave running (I do not intentionally do this).

 

[seneysolar]

Finally got camp opened up. Inrush for the pump is just shy of 32A. Lasts one second. Then she runs 10.6 to 11.6 for around a minute. My generator supplies 119.6V under no load and was at 112V when the pump was on.

Looked on currentconnected.com at a multiplus 24/3000 which appeared to have a 5kva peak. When I emailed about the duration of that figure the representative said 10 seconds and that itn ould not power my load. A little confused as to why.

Would I be breaking any hard and fast rules where you factor in some type of precentage I don't know about?

Thanks

The regular Multiplus 24/3000/70 has a peak power of 6000W. That should start your pump without an issue.

It appears the Multiplus II does have lower peak power at 5500W (still that should be ok). I dont see the duration spec'd in writing, so id take their word on 10 seconds. Perhaps Currentconnected is just staying on the safe side for motor startup?

Looking at all the features, you don't need the "II", and the greater peak power would steer me towards the regular Multiplus.

You might also consider a Capacitor start control for the pump, they are not expensive - CSIR control

 

[Mattb4]

Trying to think of a heavy load, but still plugs into a 120vAC circuit, to test on my 3kW AIO I decided to give my shops air compressor a test. It is a 10gal 150psi unit that lists 15amps. I wheeled it down to the house and plugged it in. Test conditions had the battery at 26.9vDC and little to no PV coming in. I had turned off most other loads on the AIO.

Starting from 0psi was absolutely no issue. I stopped the compressor at 50psi and then restarted it. It had a very slight but noticeable lag trying to get running but the AIO still did it. I ran the compressor up to 100psi, again stopped and attempted restart. Might have been a bit more grunt but it still started it and it eventually ran it up to the 150psi shutoff.

I still have not found anything this AIO will not start if it is a normal 120vAC plug in item.

 

[seneysolar]

Trying to think of a heavy load, but still plugs into a 120vAC circuit, to test on my 3kW AIO I decided to give my shops air compressor a test. It is a 10gal 150psi unit that lists 15amps. I wheeled it down to the house and plugged it in. Test conditions had the battery at 26.9vDC and little to no PV coming in. I had turned off most other loads on the AIO.

Starting from 0psi was absolutely no issue. I stopped the compressor at 50psi and then restarted it. It had a very slight but noticeable lag trying to get running but the AIO still did it. I ran the compressor up to 100psi, again stopped and attempted restart. Might have been a bit more grunt but it still started it and it eventually ran it up to the 150psi shutoff.

I still have not found anything this AIO will not start if it is a normal 120vAC plug in item.

Using the OP's measured 32A inrush current, I think the SRNE or Midnite 3k AIO would start the pump but it's so close to the limit I'm not sure I'd do that on purpose while in the design stages. Midnite lists 4500W surge and from what I've read that's only for 1-2 seconds. Then build in some wire losses and variations in battery voltage, temps, and having something else on (lights, TV, and so on) it may be asking for trouble. I think I would want some more head room.

Thats good news on the air compressor. I have an older Dewalt compressor that sometimes trips my15A AC breaker in the house if the compressor is cold, that thing is a hog.

 

[indaUPeh]

Sent a clarifying email before looking at other options. The rep thought my 32A was SFA vs inrush. The 5kva for 10 seconds is enough. I would like to think a 25% cushion makes it a capable enough choice.

Feels good to be a step closer. What appears to be 10 years of a warranty through them has had the Victron at the top of my list.

I'll mainly be using it as a battery backup vs solar until some more seat time on the dozer makes way for a small ground array I can reposition throughout the season.

 

[LakeHouse]

Trying to think of a heavy load, but still plugs into a 120vAC circuit, to test on my 3kW AIO I decided to give my shops air compressor a test. It is a 10gal 150psi unit that lists 15amps. I wheeled it down to the house and plugged it in. Test conditions had the battery at 26.9vDC and little to no PV coming in. I had turned off most other loads on the AIO.

Starting from 0psi was absolutely no issue. I stopped the compressor at 50psi and then restarted it. It had a very slight but noticeable lag trying to get running but the AIO still did it. I ran the compressor up to 100psi, again stopped and attempted restart. Might have been a bit more grunt but it still started it and it eventually ran it up to the 150psi shutoff.

I still have not found anything this AIO will not start if it is a normal 120vAC plug in item.

I’ve got a 3.5kW rebranded SRNE, and I’ve had the same experience; I can’t find anything that it won’t run. Saws, compressors, a 1.75 hp log splitter, which is about the worst type of intermittent load possible…. No problems at all. It claims 7000W surge, and I’ve been unable to disprove that.

 

[seneysolar]

I’ve got a 3.5kW rebranded SRNE, and I’ve had the same experience; I can’t find anything that it won’t run. Saws, compressors, a 1.75 hp log splitter, which is about the worst type of intermittent load possible…. No problems at all. It claims 7000W surge, and I’ve been unable to disprove that.

Curious, what is the rebranded name of the inverter?

 

[LakeHouse]

Curious, what is the rebranded name of the inverter?

At risk of bringing down the wrath of the entire forum... It's a Renogy!
This one: https://ca.renogy.com/48v-3500w-inverter-charger/

It's the same inverter that Midnight rebrands, and so far it's a fantastic inverter, pretty good charger, and terrible SCC. I've actually moved the SCC function to a Victron 150/45. My only remaining complaint is that it won't communicate with anything except Renogy's monitoring system, which I have no desire to use.

 

[seneysolar]

At risk of bringing down the wrath of the entire forum... It's a Renogy!
This one: https://ca.renogy.com/48v-3500w-inverter-charger/

It's the same inverter that Midnight rebrands, and so far it's a fantastic inverter, pretty good charger, and terrible SCC. I've actually moved the SCC function to a Victron 150/45. My only remaining complaint is that it won't communicate with anything except Renogy's monitoring system, which I have no desire to use.

Ahh, thank you for your Renogy confession

I have heard the same, Renogy inverters are the only decent Renogy product. Being a rebranded SRNE makes sense. Good to hear they are not ultra sensitive to overloads.

The integrated SCC is what I dislike about all of the AIO units. It leaves you stuck with whatever they give you. Then when you are forced use a standalone SCC because of sizing incompatibility or failure, at that point the screen on the AIO is mostly irrelevant. Reminds me of the days when I had a TV with built in VCR...

 

[Rednecktek]

The integrated SCC is what I dislike about all of the AIO units. It leaves you stuck with whatever they give you. Then when you are forced use a standalone SCC because of sizing incompatibility or failure, at that point the screen on the AIO is mostly irrelevant. Reminds me of the days when I had a TV with built in VCR...

True to a point, but if you were to add up the component costs the AIO's always come out cheaper which is what makes them such a good value. There's also nothing stopping you from adding independant SCC's and arrays and getting extra juice into the batteries. Since AIO's tend to come with 60 or 80a SCC's it's a really good start.

 

[seneysolar]

True to a point, but if you were to add up the component costs the AIO's always come out cheaper which is what makes them such a good value. There's also nothing stopping you from adding independant SCC's and arrays and getting extra juice into the batteries. Since AIO's tend to come with 60 or 80a SCC's it's a really good start.

Yes they do indeed have a great price. Honestly I'm tempted to buy one myself to try it out.

The biggest issue I see with the built in CC is both the Midnight and the SRNE units we have been discussing here have 100V max PV input. With todays panels, it can be difficult to stay under 100V on a string of 2. You really have to watch for something in the 40Voc range when buying panels. I see many are touching 50V now, you'd have to parallel each panel in that case

 

[Mattb4]

My 3kW PowMr which are SRNE have 450Voc max PV range and 80a. Almost the same unit as the older low voltage PV. I upgraded my older EAsun because of wanting the higher PV voltage to work with.