Using your Electric Vehicle to power your home

[BigDoug]

I came across this video on Youtube tonight in my recommended feed. This couple used their F150 Lightning to run their home/apartment. There were a few issues along the way, but overall it seemed to work well enough.

One interesting thing I noted from the video was that the batteries in the car are supposedly under warranty for 8 years or 100,000 miles. My thoughts were that utilizing them as a home power station of sorts - regularly, at that - what does that do as far as the warranty?

I dunno, just found it to be an interesting use case and thought it would be interesting to discuss from a solar/battery/power aspect. Especially at the price point (claimed at $49,000).

 

[houseofancients]

Makes for most zero sense..

Car charges "free" with solar during the day.
Yet car isn't there as folks are at work
Return home at night needing power, yet car is empty, unless charged expensively from grid

Just my 2 cents

 

[teal95]

Exactly my thoughts. If the government really wants to push EV and solar they should be pushing employers to have solar powered charging stations. For most working stiffs when the sun is shining their car is at work.

I work for an automaker who is, of course, fully in on the EV madness. So of course we keep putting in more charging stations for the test vehicles. (Of course none in the employee lots.). So many that we've overrun our electrical substations. So despite have a 3x5 MILE area to put ground mount panels they instead put in a new substation twice the size of the previous ones.

 

[BigDoug]

Makes for most zero sense..

Car charges "free" with solar during the day.
Yet car isn't there as folks are at work
Return home at night needing power, yet car is empty, unless charged expensively from grid

Just my 2 cents

There's definitely a use-case scenario that does and doesn't make sense (at least some sense).

Some examples: People who work from home or live close to work. You aren't "empty" in those scenarios. Their car ran their home for nearly a week without being charged (or driven). It's a very large battery bank to tap into.

You live somewhere that it's incredibly expensive to get grid power. These guys live in the mountains. I can't imagine the cost it would have been to have the power company run poles and lines to them but it was probably multiples of the cost of their truck. If you, generally speaking, work on your property like it seems they do (and in today's age plenty of others do, too), this could make sense to go with a very small battery system to power your home when you and your vehicle are gone rather than investing in a normal car and a 30kwh battery system, inverter(s), etc.

Charging expensively from the grid depends on where you live. I'm paying $0.084 per kwh with no on/off peak differentiator. Some places are paying nearly 10 times that for on peak and still more than what I pay for their off peak. That's going to be a factor, for sure. My cheap rates are likely going to start going up soon because in the last year, even though we aren't being charged different rates yet, the bills have begun to show off peak and on peak usage. When I called to ask about it because I wanted to know if we were being charged different rates and what the hours for each was I was told that was just informational, but that in the future it's possible they would be making the change (they already have in other markets they are in).

With 10k of panels, they can certainly take more advantage of solar charging than some others can. But also not as much as some others.

 

[timselectric]

Each situation is different.
For the youtuber it makes perfect sense. They are home during the day. It increases their storage capacity. And let's them put excess production to use.
And it's cheaper to charge in town, than to run a generator at home.

 

[Vigo]

I think having a car as a BACKUP power solution is brilliant, and to that point a hybrid is even better than a full EV in that scenario. For example a ford hybrid f150 (Powerboost) can do something silly like 35kw out, and probably also has a 25-35 gallon fuel tank.

If you try to use an EV to 'time shift' your consumption due to TOU or something like that, it really depends on the circumstances whether it's going to work out. For me i could see it easily working out in many scenarios IF the Kwh you are using out of the vehicle still leaves enough for whatever your normal use will be afterward during that day or 'time cycle'.

 

[millsan1]

I actually have something like this as an absolute backup.

My SXS is electric with 48 volt batteries.

Total capacity is about 13 KWH.

I have a BB175 Anderson connector into the batteries in the SXS. I have another BB175 that I can connect to my Inverter, worst case scenario.

Worst case is no sun, all my LifePower4 are depleted and generator won't run.

I would then bring SXS to house, unplug the charger 175, wire in the spare 175 to inverter, and connect.

This will give me about 12 hours of run time on the house. Of course, again, worst case scenario, but it is cool to have it as a backup if need be.

 

[Madcodger]

I like the idea of EVs, and we'll likely buy one in the future. I think eventually they'll be the norm for most of us. But as a home backup power source for most people? Oh. gimme a break. Power goes out and you want to keep things like the heat and refrigerator running, but then there's that pesky need to go to work, even though the power's out. There goes the power source... We both work from home, and I still wouldn't rely on a vehicle as the backup power.

 

[wpns]

Unfortunately, getting power _out_ of an EV is difficult, other than hacks like use the AC inverter in the vehicle to charge your home batteries, etc. The CHADEMO standard has unfortunately faded away, the Tesla chargers are apparently _hardware_ capable of bidirectional power, but of course enabling the software runs up against so many safety requirements and listings that it's nearly impossible to actually implement, and while there are efforts towards standardizing V2G connections, it's very slow going through all the standards committees.

Yeah, I'd love to have a battery-only inverter in my FL condo to get extra power (my current feed is 50 amps, so I can't have a fast EV charger or tankless hot water or ...) to act as a whole-house-UPS, and during an extended power outage be able to drive my 'portable power pack' to somewhere that _has_ power, and bring those KWHR home, but that's more in the realm of "conceivable" than "implementable".

Look how hard it is to get UL9540(A) certification, and then try to map that to very EV manufacturer out there.

 

[Q-Dog]

I like the idea of EVs, and we'll likely buy one in the future. I think eventually they'll be the norm for most of us. But as a home backup power source for most people? Oh. gimme a break. Power goes out and you want to keep things like the heat and refrigerator running, but then there's that pesky need to go to work, even though the power's out. There goes the power source... We both work from home, and I still wouldn't rely on a vehicle as the backup power.

I would assume most people would set up a critical loads panel for power outages and not try to run the entire house from the vehicle? Dunno.

We have a 20 kWh backup battery, right now just for critical loads, and we can easily get by for a couple of days of no sun on this setup. I could go a week using an EV (80 kWh or more battery) for our critical loads, and still have enough battery left over to drive to town to charge it up if needed. Add 2000-3000 watts of solar and you would have extra during the summer to keep the vehicle topped up too.

 

[AshleyL]

Makes for most zero sense..

Car charges "free" with solar during the day.
Yet car isn't there as folks are at work
Return home at night needing power, yet car is empty, unless charged expensively from grid

Just my 2 cents

Oh.....I see......the only solution would be owning two EV for one person.......brilliant idea from EV manufacturer........Good for the economy, world and pocket of rich automobile industry.........

 

[houseofancients]

Oh.....I see......the only solution would be owning two EV for one person.......brilliant idea from EV manufacturer........Good for the economy, world and pocket of rich automobile industry.........

yeah, i'll stick to my battery bank, thank you ;-)

 

[timselectric]

It's not an either/or situation.
Having both, provides versatility.
Don't power the house from the EV. Use the EV as a backup charging source.
This will be my implementation.
Redundancy is the key to stability.

 

[houseofancients]

It's not an either/or situation.
Having both, provides versatility.
Don't power the house from the EV. Use the EV as a backup charging source.
This will be my implementation.
Redundancy is the key to stability.

but that is not what people are let to believe, nor something everybody can afford

 

[Q-Dog]

I have been thinking about this lately and have some thoughts.

How about a house battery backup with enough battery to cover overnight loads plus average daily EV use. Add enough solar to recharge the house battery on an average day. Now you can charge the EV from the house battery over night, charge the house battery from solar during the day, and still have enough battery capacity to cover an overnight outage. In a long power outage the EV can top up the battery if needed.

 

[Hedges]

Makes for most zero sense..

Car charges "free" with solar during the day.
Yet car isn't there as folks are at work
Return home at night needing power, yet car is empty, unless charged expensively from grid

Just my 2 cents

What makes lots of sense is charging car at night, if grid has surplus production (Hydro? Baseline nuke? Isn't it Oregon where wind power had to be curtailed?)

Or, charging during the day while at work, or at the mall if that is your thing. Presently, the "Duck's Back" is because there is so much grid tied PV that PG&E can't even figure out what to do with the power and it is worth less than $zero. So take in rooftop PV, utility scale PV, etc., redistribute around town, charge EVs wherever they may be parked and plugged in.

This requires the utility to provide the service of carrying power over their power lines. Which could be done for a fee, additional revenue from existing wires, and should raise the value of rooftop PV backfeed so that can be paid a credit.

Some people could even charge at work, power their home at night. After all, utility says the Duck's Back curve represents people getting home and turning on loads. Whether on or off grid, Storing power during the day and using in the evening helps fix the Duck's Back.

 

[timselectric]

but that is not what people are let to believe, nor something everybody can afford

I'm not sure I follow.
I know that it's advertised as a home backup in a grid down situation. Which it definitely can do. But surely people understand that the vehicle has to be there, for it to work.
The video shows it being used exactly how I would.

 

[houseofancients]

I'm not sure I follow.
I know that it's advertised as a home backup in a grid down situation. Which it definitely can do. But surely people understand that the vehicle has to be there, for it to work.
The video shows it being used exactly how I would.

and my points are :

if you want to make it work like a proper 24/7 battery, the vehicle needs to stay on site
if you want "free" charging the vehicle needs to be on-site
if you want a backup , the vehicle needs to be on-site and fully charged

maybe works for folks who are willing to accept no power to anything when not home
maybe acceptable for folks always at home

will not work for independent working folks that need that vehicle during the day ( like most of us), unless we accept off site expensive charging ( does anyone really expect "free" power from clients they visit or even employers ?

to me this is a fractional backup at best, but v2h is for most people simply a pipedream

 

[Q-Dog]

and my points are :

if you want to make it work like a proper 24/7 battery, the vehicle needs to stay on site
if you want "free" charging the vehicle needs to be on-site
if you want a backup , the vehicle needs to be on-site and fully charged

maybe works for folks who are willing to accept no power to anything when not home
maybe acceptable for folks always at home

will not work for independent working folks that need that vehicle during the day ( like most of us), unless we accept off site expensive charging ( does anyone really expect "free" power from clients they visit or even employers ?

to me this is a fractional backup at best, but v2h is for most people simply a pipedream

It is just another selling point. Don't need to buy a generator for power outages because the vehicle can do that. It is a backup for when you are home and the power goes out. If you need to backup your house power when you are not home, that is a different scenario, and there are plenty of solutions that already exist for that.

 

[houseofancients]

It is just another selling point. Don't need to buy a generator for power outages because the vehicle can do that. It is a backup for when you are home and the power goes out. If you need to backup your house power when you are not home, that is a different scenario, and there are plenty of solutions that already exist for that.

a selling point with a very very limited use case ( IMHO at least)