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Nem 2 last day to install?

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namitrs

New Member
Joined
May 14, 2024
Messages
6
Location
San Carlos
I signed a contract with Sunrun to get Solar before 31st Mar '23. They told me there were some structural issues with the roof and I had to take care of that before. I have been working with structural engineers to get it fixed, but now Sunrun tells me that I cannot get NEM 2 anymore. They never gave me any notification that I will be losing this but told me only when I reached out to them recently. Can they do this? I don't see any such thing mentioned in the contract that it needs to be installed by xx date

Welcome any suggestions
Thanks
 
It tyically is one of the Investor Owned Utilities that make that decision. It would be determined by the status of your application with them and whether it was tentatively approved. Perhaps the structural issues resulted in changes in your application which caused the initial date to be reset. Review the communicaions from your IOU if any, or ask Sunrun for confirmation that they got tentative approval. The period for installs was several years for appplications accepted before March or April 2023.
 
Did you or Sunrun apply for NEM 2 with PGE before April 15 2023? IIRC, if accepted the NEM 2 application is good for three years. Perhaps contact PGE to verify.
 
+1 to verifying whether they put your application in with PG&E. That is what matters, I don't know if there is recourse if your installer screwed up. You might consider asking on r/solar , there are more California solar industry professionals on there than here.
hwy17 said:
I thought it was a year after applications and the window is closed now.
Click to expand...
You have more than 1 year IIRC from PG&E point of view. For me the 1 year deadline came from my AHJ permit, I would have had to re-apply and pay again if I didn't get it done in time.
 
"To retain eligibility, final electrical clearance (often referred to as final building or electrical permit) must be submitted before April 15, 2026"


"How will uncompleted applications left in the portal be treated after the sunset date? Any applications that are in progress and not submitted in the portal by11:59 p.m. on April 14, 2023 will be canceled. Contractors will be notified of their need to resubmit the interconnection application in the PG&E interconnection portal under Solar Billing Plan."
 
Thanks for all your responses, really appreciate it as I am feeling lost on how to pursue this with Sunrun as they don't want to honor the contract anymore. My responses for your questions below -

"Did you or Sunrun apply for NEM 2 with PGE before April 15 2023?"
Yes, this was completed and accepted by PGE

"You might consider asking on r/solar , there are more California solar industry professionals on there than here."
Is this on reddit or some other group within this forum?
 
namitrs said:
as they don't want to honor the contract anymore
Click to expand...
What do you mean by this? Presumably the profit margin of a NEM2 contract is higher than getting a new lead and closing for NEM+Storage. So I have some cognitive dissonance. But, I'm just a random internet dog on a forum, and not an industry insider, so my basis for dissonance is not well founded.

namitrs said:
Yes, this was completed and accepted by PGE
Click to expand...
OK, good, how did you confirm this paper trail? Is it in their system?

Potentially there is a way to transfer contractors in some special cases.

namitrs said:
"You might consider asking on r/solar , there are more California solar industry professionals on there than here."
Is this on reddit or some other group within this forum?
Click to expand...
Reddit. There were 2-3 very knowledgeable folks, presumably active with CALSSA, that were helping people out last year. You could try searching for those users and tagging them. I did not take good notes of their names so I would have to dig it out from first principles of Googling, sorry.
 
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I also have April 15th 2026 deadline to submit signed-off building permit to PG&E.

One reservation, PG&E requested I resubmit a form with customer (my sister's) wet signature authorizing me, using the current revision form this time. It said if not done within a year the application would be cancelled. (I stretched it to the end, to see what replacement model inverters came out.)

If a reservation was made, I would think it is for the customer and a different contractor could do the work. If it is only for your original contractor, they need to honor whatever they commitment they made - does it leave a way for them to weasel out? Otherwise, determine damages and demand compensation.

Maybe their plan was to do the work and apply prior to deadline. We DIY sorts worked on getting a reservation. Maybe your company made reservations for other customers in order to line up work but didn't do that for you.
 
PG&E NEM2 gives you three years. Note if your contractor flakes out, I was told there is a procedure that allows you to change or even DIY. I am doing my own NEM2 and have been allowed to change inverters and add batteries on a replacement application and keep NEM2. Good luck!
 
Thanks to some insights from you all, I got the following reply from their rep -

"At some point the design was updated and submitted to PG&E NEM2 application, as we were processing close to 50,000 applications in a rush.

Your NEM 2 application is still active, but the system size submitted was 7.616 kW
(no idea how this was changed but as mentioned, may be the dry rot updated the design)
Original design was 10.27 kW

Current Sunrun process is that the home is 100% ready to go before we submit a permit.
That means you would have to make those structural repairs, have Sunrun check the house again, then we should be able to install a 7.616 kW system with NEM 2. This still presents some challenges because we need to provide you with an updated agreement, and I have not gone through that process"

I have no idea how they downgraded the system when in my contract with them it clearly says 10.27 kw. What are my options now if the cant honor the initial agreed kw? I still pay around $500 / month for electricity so I am still quite motivated to get it done but was hoping was the original capacity.

Appreciate any suggestions. thanks
 

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7.6kW sounds like inverter with 40A PV breaker in 200A panel (120% rule)
10.27kW sounds like PV array (PTC) x inverter efficiency.

My reservations are based on the latter.

If nothing else, you can get a system installed within the limits of what's reserved.

In the event you added more panels later, probably would not be noticed by the utility. Especially if you're powering loads at the same time.
Ideally get the installer to put up the panels with longer rails, spacing between them, so you can slap more panels on them.

Was your NEM 2.0 application accepted as completed by PG&E? Or not yet because it needs something updated/corrected? I just finalized one, with changes, 2 weeks ago.
 
The changes were from PG&E. They reviewed your historic usage and decided how much they would allow you. I had requested a 32 panel 12.8KW system w/12K inverter. PG&E downgraded my approved system at 24 panels 9.6KW but still with 12K inverter. I am currently reapplying to the SNEM program to add battery. Believe it or not, you can make changes and still retain NEM2. Not sure if you can increase the panels though. Good luck!
 
I told them I was installing Bitcoin miner, indoor grow operation, and anti-satellite EW system, justifying capacity beyond current consumption.

I didn't let PG&E make changes.

When they said 15kW of PV exceeded max allowed by Sunny Boy 7.7, I replied, "I meant to do that." I showed that neither voltage nor current was exceeded. I said panels would be of different orientations such that peak never exceeded 10kW. (based on SunPower 327W panels, 2 parallel strings per input)

When I updated recently I called out SB 7.7 + SB 3.8 = 11.5kW, as a placeholder for SBSE 11.5, not available yet.
PG&E responded that 20 (out of 40) panels on SB 3.8 exceeded its max PV. I said make that 24 panels on SB 7.7, 16 panels on SB 3.8, and that was accepted. (New East Solar 370W panels)

Due to slightly higher efficiency, I expect SBSE system to exceed reserved wattage. So I'll reduce to 39 panels, 3 strings of 13.

May add battery later.
 
Gold Country Russ said:
The changes were from PG&E.
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I had a NEM 2.0 application into SCE and they questioned the size of the system. I made an attestation that I was going to add charging stations in the building for tenants and they finally approved the request. I did the same thing on my residence with PG&E because the prior owners used very little electrical power. I had two EVs when I bought the home and was planning on converting the gas FAU to an A/C heat pump and they approved the request. I did not have to go as far as @Hedges did by telling them I was going to install a bitcoin miner but the point is that there is flexibility if you go through the hoops.
 
IIRC NEM2 is a lot more flexible for gaming than NEM3. NEM3 has explicitly anti oversizing auditing.

So the question is whether PG&E can be theoretically prevailed upon to revisit the size. And whether this is achievable in practice when you have to go through a layer of contractor.

And whether 7kW on NEM2 beats 10kW on NEM3, if that’s what it has to be. Most likely
 
Actually, I just listed a kWh/year figure that that was all that was needed.

In my 200A service upgrade request I initially tabulated electric heat, water heater, dryer to justify my PV. But upon learning I didn't have those loads yet, they approved service upgrade without them doing anything. Service drop looks like 2 awg (aluminum) and lineman said good up to about 150A.

Right, NEM 2.0 was on the honor system.

As I said, 7kW vs. 10kW of panels, don't think anyone will know or care.
 
zanydroid said:
NEM3 has explicitly anti oversizing auditing.
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I have not heard that. I thought I heard NEM 3.0 was more relaxed about oversizing because when the IOU is only paying wholesale for export, they can actually make money off residential export. Also, technically the power is distributed through out the local neighborhood and theorectically there is little loss because it rarely makes it to a substation.
 
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Ampster said:
I have not heard that. I thought I heard NEM 3.0 was more relaxed about oversizing because when the IOU is only paying wholesale for export, they can actually make money off residential export.
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I vaguely remember something about having to actually hit your promised usage within X years
 
I don't even know how they would define promised usage since solar production would reduce net consumption. Given that the CPUC has approved a new fixed charge I think the IOUs revenue model is changing.
 
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