An absolute noob who knows nothing and needs some advice on solar generators

[Bubba1969]

Hello everyone- I am a complete clueless solar idiot who is trying to learn and I need some help. I've done some research and am completely overwhelmed. Here is what I am hoping to do-

I need to power a boat lift and some lights on a dock via solar- My power usage should be:

An 11.9A motor that draws approximagtely 1134 watts while running and a max of 1640 on start up (110v). This is from the manufacturer. It is essentially a blower motor used to displace water that is extremely similar to a shop vac motor (the current motor is actually branded as Electrolux)

The run cycle is approximately 5-8 minutes per use, probably 3-5 times per week (living in GA, so lots of sunlight)==i.e., when the lift is in operation The system usage is concentrated to weekends during the summer.

I would also like to be able to power a string of basic patio lights in the evenings for 1-2 hours, 2 nights a week.

The cost of running 110 is crazy stupid so I am looking at a solar generator type setup. I've looked into building a solar/battery/controller/inverter system, but given that the only protection I will have is a fiberglass dock box, it would have some exposure to the humidity and face continual motion from wave action. My thought was that I could use a Solar Generator such as the Ecoflow Delta Max 2 or a Bluetti AC200L and tie that into a permanent solar panel. Grecell seems to be another cost concsious option that is well reviewed. One would easily fit in my Dock Box. Because we don't use the lift in the winter, I would be able to bring the entire unit inside to avoid freezing temps for the 2-3 days of cold temps we get annually. I know they are expensive, but less than 1/6th the cost of running a 110 line to the dock and I think it should be infinitly safer---every year someone gets electrocuted on the lake due to faulty dock wiring. I am not tied to these brands at all, but they seem to be some of the best balance of price to performance from what I can tell, so if there is a "hidden gem" out there, recommendations are most welcome.

I'm a pretty handy person, but electrical load requirements leave me scratching my head.

Hopefully someone will be willing to help a guy trying to learn. If I'm in the wrong place, please feel free to tell me and I'll leave quietly in peace.

Thank you in advance,
Bubba

 

[sunshine_eggo]

I find it very hard to believe a 1134W run power of a motor is only 1640W on startup. Motor surge is typically about 5X run, so I would make sure that's nailed down 1000% before proceeding.

 

[SoggyShoes]

@Bubba1969 there is no reason to reinvent the wheel.

There are several boat lift systems that have all in one boxes with the battery and a hydraulic vegetable oil pump inside with a small solar panel on top.
Around here Basta (https://bastaboatlifts.com/), Hewitt (https://www.hewittrad.com/), and ShoreMaster (https://www.shoremaster.com/) are very popular. I have a Basta that I have had for years and it has worked flawlessly. The system has always had the power to lift the boat multiple times a day. All easily done using the remote control. In fact, the remote battery seems to be the weak spot in that it only lasts a year or two.
A buddy of mine has the same system but added lights both underwater and around the dock. He has had this system for close to 20 years and was complaining that it seems to be slowing down. Well, we found out he had never changed the oil! We flushed it and put new oil and it works like new!

I believe all these companies sell only the solar boxes. If you need a solar box that is not hydraulic, they may be able to put what you need together for you.

 

[Bubba1969]

@Bubba1969 there is no reason to reinvent the wheel.

There are several boat lift systems that have all in one boxes with the battery and a hydraulic vegetable oil pump inside with a small solar panel on top.
Around here Basta (https://bastaboatlifts.com/), Hewitt (https://www.hewittrad.com/), and ShoreMaster (https://www.shoremaster.com/) are very popular. I have a Basta that I have had for years and it has worked flawlessly. The system has always had the power to lift the boat multiple times a day. All easily done using the remote control. In fact, the remote battery seems to be the weak spot in that it only lasts a year or two.
A buddy of mine has the same system but added lights both underwater and around the dock. He has had this system for close to 20 years and was complaining that it seems to be slowing down. Well, we found out he had never changed the oil! We flushed it and put new oil and it works like new!

I believe all these companies sell only the solar boxes. If you need a solar box that is not hydraulic, they may be able to put what you need together for you.

@SoggyShoes-

First, thank you for replying- I completely understand where you are coming from and your are correct, however, the lifts used on my lake are a bit different that the ones you are describing ( all floating, due to water depth)- Take a look at this- www.hydrohoist.com They do not use a mechanical lift mechanism, but rather an air displacement system. Hydrohoist will sell me a DC motor, but they want $1100 (sourcing a DC air displacement motor has proven much more difficult that I thought) As such, there is only one "all in one" system out there--- www.lakelifter.com It is nearly double the price of a solar generator type system and involves converting to 24vDC. The other challenge is that I live on an Army Core of Engineers lake which has some really strange rules, one of them being only 1 dock box and one lift control box on your own dock (crazy, I know, but they rule with an iron fist and are swift with punishment), so I would not be able to put a second box for controllers or batteries. I have spoken to the AOCE on several occasions and there are many documented cases who have paid the consequences. Because of all of they crazy regulations, I was thinking that going with a solar generator type setup that would fit in my current dockbox and stay "under the radar". Here's an example of the challenging rules- I currently run my boat lift off of a gas powered generator, which they do not like, but will allow--however, the rules are printed that state...you may use a gas powered generator and you make keep a gas powered generator on your own dock, but it must be drained of fuel each time and stored empty. They have the authority to board your dock and manually check at any time. A violation could be $500. Now, I run this generator for less than 10 mins per usage 2-3 times per week...so, in theory I must drain the tank each time...hassle I don't want.

As for the question regarding power usage, I question it myself and intend to get a usage meter this weekend to verify--it's simply what the manufacture quoted me.

Again, thank you in advance and I am absolutely open to ideas that I may not have thought of

 

[Bubba1969]

I find it very hard to believe a 1134W run power of a motor is only 1640W on startup. Motor surge is typically about 5X run, so I would make sure that's nailed down 1000% before proceeding.

Good point and agreed- I will be testing this weekend. That info is what the manufacturer supplied when I talked to them. It is essentially a shop vac motor.

 

[littleharbor2]

Simplifying matters a little, you can get some solar string lights from Costco, Home Depot, Harbor freight and others that work great.

 

[Bubba1969]

Simplifying matters a little, you can get some solar string lights from Costco, Home Depot, Harbor freight and others that work great.

Yes, but the bigger question is the lift motor.....

 

[Rednecktek]

You'll need to get a meter that can get the inrush current on that lift motor, then just round up to the next Kw size unit.

 

[Bubba1969]

You'll need to get a meter that can get the inrush current on that lift motor, then just round up to the next Kw size unit.

The meter is arriving later today

 

[MTM98290]

How large is the dock box?

You could convert you generator to propane, then just unhook the hose when you are finished running the lift.

A solar generator may be nice to have for the boat or power outages etc. So it may be a good choice.

 

[Bubba1969]

How large is the dock box?

You could convert you generator to propane, then just unhook the hose when you are finished running the lift.

A solar generator may be nice to have for the boat or power outages etc. So it may be a good choice.

Nope---for some reason a gas generator is allowed (with the above stipulations) but anything using propane (grills, etc) are a hard "no". You can't even use them on the dock. The rules literally make no sense and are extremely frustrating. I have been told that they actually do not like solar, but currently have no rules regarding it at all.

The dock box is about 30"x25"x48" approximately, so I'm pretty sure a SG would fit without issue

 

[Supervstech]

What size is the generator you use now?

 

[Supervstech]

Northern tools has the ecoflow delta2 1800W box on the shelf.
Maybe go get one, try it amd see if it has issues running the lift.

 

[Bubba1969]

What size is the generator you use now?

It's a gas powered Generac 3300gp that came with the dock--the previous owner had it.. it puts out 3375w continuous and 5200w peak. I think it's a bit overkill as I've read of other owners doing just fine with a 2200w Honda (or Harbor Freight Predator clone), but it was in place when we bought the house so we've been living with it---now the ACOE has new rangers and they enforcing more, plus a 7hp small engine really is loud, especially on the water

 

[FLD]

Do any of the rental companies around you have solar generators for rent? I'd try a rental to see if it works.
I guess I wouldn't be surprised at the fairly low starting watts listed by the lift company, seeing as it's basically a low pressure-high volume blower.
Shore stations like yours are popular in the Hammond Indiana yacht club. That's the first place I ever saw them. Extremely reliable, low maintenance and no risk of water contamination.
Given my dislike of authority like homeowners associations, I'd probably put a 5-lb propane bottle and a hose on my boat (obviously to fuel the propane fired grill I keep on my boat), and run my propane-converted generator that way. But I'm an idiot.
Kidding aside, New give a solar generator a try. I wouldn't think it require a big solar array, given the limited usage.

 

[Bubba1969]

Do any of the rental companies around you have solar generators for rent? I'd try a rental to see if it works.
I guess I wouldn't be surprised at the fairly low starting watts listed by the lift company, seeing as it's basically a low pressure-high volume blower.
Shore stations like yours are popular in the Hammond Indiana yacht club. That's the first place I ever saw them. Extremely reliable, low maintenance and no risk of water contamination.
Given my dislike of authority like homeowners associations, I'd probably put a 5-lb propane bottle and a hose on my boat (obviously to fuel the propane fired grill I keep on my boat), and run my propane-converted generator that way. But I'm an idiot.
Kidding aside, New give a solar generator a try. I wouldn't think it require a big solar array, given the limited usage.

Great thought--I'll check.

Your description of the motor is spot on. At full capacity it is only producing 1-3psi. I also agree with your assesment of HOA type entities, however in this case, being a governement agency, they have real teeth. If they pull your dock permit, you will never get it back and your property value will drop 40% overnight.

Yes, they have done that

 

[SoggyShoes]

Nope---for some reason a gas generator is allowed (with the above stipulations) but anything using propane (grills, etc) are a hard "no". You can't even use them on the dock. The rules literally make no sense and are extremely frustrating. I have been told that they actually do not like solar, but currently have no rules regarding it at all.

The dock box is about 30"x25"x48" approximately, so I'm pretty sure a SG would fit without issue

My control box is maybe 1/3 that size. You could mount a decent panel on the lid of the box.

What about sticking with 12V DC? It would be a lot safer than AC 110v.

There are 12V shop vacs and 12V air inflators that put out a lot of air. And there are lots of options for 12V lighting.

You could mount a solar panel on the lid of the box. Inside have a 12V LFP battery with a MTTP controller connection the solar to the battery.
Then just have a 12V DC distribution box and run your lift and lights off that. I think I just saw a post in the last few days from @sunshine_eggo had some remote controller that could control all your lights.
It seems like that would keep things clean, simple, safe, and cost effective.

Also, with this, in the winter you just take the battery out and leave the big locked dock box.

 

[Bubba1969]

My control box is maybe 1/3 that size. You could mount a decent panel on the lid of the box.

What about sticking with 12V DC? It would be a lot safer than AC 110v.

There are 12V shop vacs and 12V air inflators that put out a lot of air. And there are lots of options for 12V lighting.

You could mount a solar panel on the lid of the box. Inside have a 12V LFP battery with a MTTP controller connection the solar to the battery.
Then just have a 12V DC distribution box and run your lift and lights off that. I think I just saw a post in the last few days from @sunshine_eggo had some remote controller that could control all your lights.
It seems like that would keep things clean, simple, safe, and cost effective.

Also, with this, in the winter you just take the battery out and leave the big locked dock box.

That was my first plan but finding a 2 stage blower motor with a 1.75” outlet that puts out around 145cfm powered by 12v dc is like finding a unicorn. You can find a 12v motor for a pulley system everywhere. That led me to the all in one solar lift conversion kit on the market that was 24v and over $2k plus batteries. For some reason no one makes a 12v version—I have to assume efficiency and speed. I know it seems like I’m being difficult but I’ve been trying to figure this out for over a year. That got me on thinking on the solar generator idea. I have a power meter arriving in the morning so I will get a real power consumption read. You wouldn’t think it would be such a challenge. Running 110 from the house is over 12k

 

[SoggyShoes]

@Bubba1969 challenge accepted!
Okay what about a 12V inline blower? Using one of these you could then use PVC or ABS to step the exhaust down to your 1'75" outlet.
This SEAFLO High Flow Blower Fan, 320 CFM 12 Volt has a 4" exhaust. Or this SEAFLO 4" in-Line Marine Bilge Air Blower 12V 270 CFM Quiet Boat White, might also work.
What could be cool about these is that you put a 12V multiple switch remote (relay) and then raise the boat and turn on some lights as you come in to hold you if the water is rough and see the dock. I do that with mine and it is so nice and easy.

If that doesn't work get a 12V DC motor that has the horsepower and RPMs you need to either attach a pulley wheel on the shaft or a blower unit like this one from Granger or a PTO unit.

Is this getting closer?

 

[Bubba1969]

@Bubba1969 challenge accepted!
Okay what about a 12V inline blower? Using one of these you could then use PVC or ABS to step the exhaust down to your 1'75" outlet.
This SEAFLO High Flow Blower Fan, 320 CFM 12 Volt has a 4" exhaust. Or this SEAFLO 4" in-Line Marine Bilge Air Blower 12V 270 CFM Quiet Boat White, might also work.
What could be cool about these is that you put a 12V multiple switch remote (relay) and then raise the boat and turn on some lights as you come in to hold you if the water is rough and see the dock. I do that with mine and it is so nice and easy.

If that doesn't work get a 12V DC motor that has the horsepower and RPMs you need to either attach a pulley wheel on the shaft or a blower unit like this one from Granger or a PTO unit.

Is this getting closer?

I hadn't thought of that- What is currently on the system is a 2-stage blower, like this. https://www.amazon.com/Ametek-116472-00-Motor-2-Stage-110-120/dp/B009Z0PDPI/ref=sr_1_2?crid=20XMOUW1J6YHP&dib=eyJ2IjoiMSJ9.x0EE1Y9JqsBneTnBKdsUOuZdi778XqheYxaItF9zMKzQi2-1Lq4jT6v2XSvBzjPV2ESFrXuVy_rTjRidQ4bRU3wtj43g8EJ-m_Exlu4e0G6uYoXVxFfIEMYnJrWXzwIqTTss7MO3bG7kRHLX12JFIHhmGgGJ01_ogebJaLOvGAjoZ_ShM_7rDdyZwy3q1aIairCy-LiNmmpTNe29x-vqjU2N5OrJS3v-CqKoRMUTvj4.dHZGOBxOJei3G8WoWPnxq4bBrPs1ooycf07n126ofXY&dib_tag=se&keywords=hydrohoist+boat+lift+blower+motor&qid=1714825965&sprefix=hydrohoist+boat+lift+blower+motor,aps,160&sr=8-2

After looking closer, the outlet is 1-7/8", but still that could be dealt with using a rubber coupler. The 110v versions are cheap and easy. I wonder if an inline blower such as what you recommend would be able to displace the water when the lift is "down". In case you aren't familiar, the lift is really 2 huge pontoons that fill with water and "sink" to release the boat. The pump then displaces the air to lift it. It's super simple, but it does require displacing water that is down about 3 ft under the surface of the lake. There must be a reason they all come with 2-stage motors.

To Date, this is the only DC blower motor I've seen, and it's 24v which confuses me even more as to how to build a system (I'm sure it's childs play for the members here--but figuring battery capacity and charging is where I get lost and go down rabbit holes)
. https://lakelifter.com/products/dc-...MIit6NwIP0hQMV3TbUAR1kvQ6xEAQYAiABEgJy6vD_BwE I did talk to the company about battry recommendations and they told me 6v golf cart batteries and highly advised against Lifepo4?


I truly appreciate the thoughts