Cost of solar

[corn18]

Just to update everyone, I saw BogueRV had their 200W mono panels on sale on Amazon for $172. Couldn't resist, so I bought two. N+1 is the answer

 

[sunshine_eggo]

My 5+5=10kVA Quattros idle at 27 ea.

The MP-II is almost an unfair comparison... they were engineered deliberately for very low idle consumption.

 

[Brucey]

Just to update everyone, I saw BogueRV had their 200W mono panels on sale on Amazon for $172. Couldn't resist, so I bought two. N+1 is the answer

Too much premium on those "fancy" 200W panels, here's the sweet spot that I could find:

 

[corn18]

Too much premium on those "fancy" 200W panels, here's the sweet spot that I could find:
View attachment 210095

I don't want 2x100 no matter how cheap they are.

 

[RvNaut]

It's not about where they're assembled but where they're designed and Who designs them. You can get a steak at Applebee's or at Ruth Chris's.

Mine was designed by the Germans..... so that refutes that one....

My 5kw inverters have a idle consumption of 40w each.

My system sucks about 70watts at idle, but considering the size and consumption of my system, it is a drop in the bucket and inconsequential... Oh and my system is running 24/7 so there is no idle time..... next!

Victron is 5year warranty by default and you can get them with a 10yr.

..and there you do have me.... I am my warranty.... I will mention that if I smoke my BMS for ANY REASON, the mfg will replace, no questions asked. I also used grade A cells....

All their specs and efficiency rating charts are posted

So are mine...

Look... all of the above is you clamoring about how great Victron is, but you present nothing to say that AIOs are a bad choice. You are doing nothing but fear mongering... as for prices... Victron is not just a little more....

AIOs get a bad rap, but no one seems to have any real world experience with them going bad.....

 

[justinm001]

Mine was designed by the Germans..... so that refutes that one....



My system sucks about 70watts at idle, but considering the size and consumption of my system, it is a drop in the bucket and inconsequential... Oh and my system is running 24/7 so there is no idle time..... next!




..and there you do have me.... I am my warranty.... I will mention that if I smoke my BMS for ANY REASON, the mfg will replace, no questions asked. I also used grade A cells....

So are mine...

Look... all of the above is you clamoring about how great Victron is, but you present nothing to say that AIOs are a bad choice. You are doing nothing but fear mongering... as for prices... Victron is not just a little more....

AIOs get a bad rap, but no one seems to have any real world experience with them going bad.....

Which AIO do you have? I'd love to compare the efficiency specs but never found an AIO with real data.

70watts is about the consumption of my 10kw system including mppts, cerbogx, screen and usb devices/sensors. Idle consumption is added on top of efficiency usually so if you have a 70w idle consumption and are inverting 1000w at 90% you're burning 170w so really 83%.

I'm a vehicle setup every watt matters. If you're 50w more then that's 1200wh per day, or need a 200w panel just to keep up with additional consumption.

 

[Brucey]

Look... all of the above is you clamoring about how great Victron is, but you present nothing to say that AIOs are a bad choice. You are doing nothing but fear mongering... as for prices... Victron is not just a little more....

AIOs get a bad rap, but no one seems to have any real world experience with them going bad.....

The generation before the 6000XP would seem to answer this question?

I.e. warranty trade in deals, trade in discounts as they fail like popcorn all over the place.

 

[Partimewages]

There are plenty of threads about issues with AOIs. There are others that have had success.

 

[Tulex]

There are plenty of threads about issues with AOIs. There are others that have had success.

I think it's more accurate to say issues with some brands of AIOs. Many people are running Sol-Arks and the 18k (sorry Tim) with no issue.

 

[sunshine_eggo]

AiO trends:

Made by/design derived from Voltronics/Voltronics-like = hit or miss.
Made by/design derived from Luxpower/DEYE = much better.

 

[AntronX]

I think cheapest equivalent RV solar system will be 3x 400W $156 panels, $468 total. Run 9x LF304K cells in series for 30.6V charging voltage direct from panels wired in parallel and without MPPT but via simple DC contactor controlled by battery voltage detector to protect cells from overcharging. That would get you within 94% of MPPT in full sun without the expense. For the price of 24V 50A MPPT you could add another 400W panel and capture ~20% more energy vs. 3x panels + MPPT. Most 24V inverters should handle 31.5V input at 3.5V/cell. Nice thing about staying at 29V nominal vs. 51V is stepping down to 12V via buck DC-DC converters is much more efficient. Also there are 24V truck air conditioners that would be more efficient running from DC directly.

 

[sunshine_eggo]

I think cheapest equivalent RV solar system will be 3x 400W $156 panels, $468 total. Run 9x LF304K cells in series for 30.6V charging voltage direct from panels wired in parallel and without MPPT but via simple DC contactor controlled by battery voltage detector to protect cells from overcharging. That would get you within 94% of MPPT in full sun without the expense. For the price of 24V 50A MPPT you could add another 400W panel and capture ~20% more energy vs. 3x panels + MPPT. Most 24V inverters should handle 31.5V input at 3.5V/cell. Nice thing about staying at 29V nominal vs. 51V is stepping down to 12V via buck DC-DC converters is much more efficient.

Dayum... you've gone old school... I think you'd need to experiment with 30.6V as it may take awhile to get cells fully or even nearly fully charged at 3.4V/cell. I needed 5.5 hours of absorption on a 7.5 hour total charge to get to full @ 3.4V/cell.

 

[AntronX]

Dayum... you've gone old school...

I like it cheap and simple (and efficient)

 

[rustythorn]

the OP was about solar vs gas geny costs. gas generator produces about 4-7 kwh per gallon, smaller gens are less efficient. the last pic i saw showed they had 1200 watts of solar, depending on location that will yield an average of 6-6.6 kwh per day so likely more than what one gallon will produce with that generator, however, it is unlikely they will use every photon every day so lets just say that solar system equals one gallon of gas per day. right now average price is 3.63 and rising but based on where you are the price is around 3-5 dollars. it is unlikely they will be camping everyday so lets just use 300 days. that will be $900-$1500 per year in gas so in a few years the solar will be cheaper.

 

[Brucey]

the OP was about solar vs gas geny costs. gas generator produces about 4-7 kwh per gallon, smaller gens are less efficient. the last pic i saw showed they had 1200 watts of solar, depending on location that will yield an average of 6-6.6 kwh per day so likely more than what one gallon will produce with that generator, however, it is unlikely they will use every photon every day so lets just say that solar system equals one gallon of gas per day. right now average price is 3.63 and rising but based on where you are the price is around 3-5 dollars. it is unlikely they will be camping everyday so lets just use 300 days. that will be $900-$1500 per year in gas so in a few years the solar will be cheaper.

I was looking at a Victron document regarding applications for hybrid generator designs, I think claim was each battery kWh saved a liter of fuel in the generator based on not having to run full time.

 

[justinm001]

the OP was about solar vs gas geny costs. gas generator produces about 4-7 kwh per gallon, smaller gens are less efficient. the last pic i saw showed they had 1200 watts of solar, depending on location that will yield an average of 6-6.6 kwh per day so likely more than what one gallon will produce with that generator, however, it is unlikely they will use every photon every day so lets just say that solar system equals one gallon of gas per day. right now average price is 3.63 and rising but based on where you are the price is around 3-5 dollars. it is unlikely they will be camping everyday so lets just use 300 days. that will be $900-$1500 per year in gas so in a few years the solar will be cheaper.

My 20kw generator burns .34 / .68 / 1.50 gallons of diesel/hr for 25/50/100% load. Diesel is $4/gal so 10kwh is $3.

20 kW Diesel Generator Details

ENCLOSED CONFIGURATION OPEN CONFIGURATION EPS 20kW Tier 4 Final Diesel Mobile Generator Specifications Configuration Enclosed Open EPS Model Number S10020J4ENC S10020T4C3 KW – Stand-by (1) 20.9 20.9 KW – Continuous (1) 19.4 19.4 120 / 240V

www.enginepowersource.com

 

[Nobodybusiness]

I just put in a generic $0.50 / W. I can get 375W mono panels off of Facebook marketplace from a guy 8 miles away for $135. That's $0.36 / W. Been thinking about getting two of them.

Does he have 60 of them?

 

[Nobodybusiness]

What started me down this nutty path of big blue shiny stuff was when I installed a Victron smart shunt and found this rat's nest:
View attachment 209502

My electrical OCD just couldn't handle that. So I redid the whole system. This is what I took out:
View attachment 209504

That rat's nest was replaced by about 10 ft of wire. Now I can look at my system and not get brain pain.

Those obligatory self reset breakers that almost all RV have.
I helped my son redo his because it looked just like that.
Drove us crazy too.

 

[Nobodybusiness]

It pays to be frugal. I’m less than $10k in to 60kwh of battery, 23kw of panels, and 10kw of inverter.
Obviously panel racking is gonna kill me but one can be fairly simple/cheap too.
A pair of 3kw inverters and 4 eco-worthy batteries sets one back less than 2500 bucks. Could easily get as many panels as you can fit for under 500. That just dropped your buy in, in half

and mold, water leaks, cheap plumbing, cheap hvac, r5 insulation at best, 7mpg wherever I want to go instead of 15, 60ft of length pulling in and out of parking lots, endless propane usage.
It gets old.
Don’t get me wrong, I’d still rather “camp” but we have also rented hotel rooms so we could simply spread out as well

We had a 5th wheel for a while and for bondocking it was great.

20+ foot F-350 + 40 ft 5th wheel trying to make kiss your butt turns in small resort towns.

Paying $60 night for a pad in a beachside resort.
Trying to park between 2 trees and a guy with his lawn chair staring at you daring you to hit him.
Then the slide out. Hooking up sewer,water, electric, leveling, awning, rugs,etc.

In my case every time we went to use the thing something wasn’t working.
Im sure it was my fault but dead battery or Frig suddenly decided to spew its ammonia all over the side of the camper, propane auto valve between tanks failed, random leak we never found were water pooled on the bedroom window seal, on and on.


It’s just got to be easier to Airbnb or something else.

Very much a personal thing I guess.

 

[corn18]

Does he have 60 of them?

I think so.