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Is there an easy way to tell if a unit is pure sine wave vs modified?

To read correct voltages with a modified sine wave you need a true RMS meter. My cheaper meters without RMS all read modified at about 90v, while my flukes read the true 120ish. Your scope won't ever read the right voltage, but it's a neat little gadget and the scope looks good enough for the $$.
 
SolarRat said:
To read correct voltages with a modified sine wave you need a true RMS meter. My cheaper meters without RMS all read modified at about 90v, while my flukes read the true 120ish. Your scope won't ever read the right voltage, but it's a neat little gadget and the scope looks good enough for the $$.
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Well, wether one has a meter that averages root, means, squared or wether one takes the individual measurements and does the RMS calculation themself for the more precise measurement, doesn't pure sine wave refer to the quality of the sinusoidal wave form being produced, rather than the accuracy of the voltage level being produced, (not that precise voltage isn't extremely important as well)?
 
SCClockDr said:
Looks like that unit is also available on Amazon. No questions or reviews as yet.
Portable Ultra-small Digital Oscilloscope 1M Bandwidth 5M Sample Rate Digital Oscilloscope Kit Mini Pocket Handheld
View attachment 1742
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George, the units seem to be carried by several sources. I bought mine from Banggood, and the price at the time was US$ 23.74 including shipping. I see where their present price is greater than that asked on Amazon. One thing to know about Banggood is the prices change dramatically day to day. Sometimes they have the same item listed side by side with different prices, curious...pays to check. One has to check prices at time of purchase to see who has best prices.

Steve_S, "
That's a High Frequency Inverter, use with electronics only, no motors or induction devices, unless you want to replace things.." so if I am understanding what you are saying these units (all regardless of pure sine or modified sine wave) are not appropriate for something like a CPAP which has fans?

Offgriddle, Thank you that's a good video. I will set up several "heat globes" aka incandescent lights thru a power strip and see how it responds to loads.






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On the MSW inverters, the scope is likely measuring twice the frequency as it doesn't know when to actually start and stop. My experience is these inverters are right on within half a hertz. Square waveforms will always have a lower peak voltage for the same RMS value as a sine wave, it is the area under the curve that counts. For some things that matters a little. I have a half dozen sine wave inverters on the shelf, I don't use them. I still run everything with MSW.
 
Steve_S said:
@Wiley you might want to give this a read, answers many questions nice & neat.

Inversion Methods Explained: High Frequency vs Low Frequency | Magnum Dimensions

Understand the difference between high frequency and low frequency inverters with this quick article.
www.magnum-dimensions.com www.magnum-dimensions.com
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Wow, Thanks Steve. That was certainly an eye opener when one follows thru to products and prices. Roughly an order of magnitude higher....with the caveat (like stepping off a cliff) the first step will be dramatic. Cost for an 800 Watt unit only a few hundred less than the cost for a 2000 watt unit. The hidden costs for the larger units being as one would expect...the size of battery bank to power it.

Quickly this brings me back to where I started: That being (for my needs) a PV set up for lights and entertainment with anything needing serious power coming from either the grid (if the grid is available) or a generator if it isn't.
 
$$ difference is the first thing that everyone notices, funny how a persons wallet can cringe eh ! Hmmm Smart Wallet ?
I have a few dead HF Inverters if you wanna pay for shipping, even a King 3Kw Inverter Generator (Crappy HF blew up), they are scrap though and not much point, irreparable. How did I kill them, Table Saw, Compressor, Chop Saw (all while I was building my home, just to add to the $ misery). I got an LF 3Kw Yiyen "Cheapo Chinese" and that took it all and never blinked but the 30Lb Copper Coil had a lot to do with that I'm pretty sure, it is now my backup Inverter/Charger. REF: https://www.yiyen.com/product/apc-series-pure-sine-wave-inverter-charger/ I bought mine from a Marine Supply house for 650 USD ? or thereabouts. I'm now using a Samlex EVO-4024 but that is quite a bit more cash but features & functions and communications with it +++
 
Below are 3 photo's of the insides of my Yiyen APC3024 Low Frequency Inverter/Charger.
Below that is 1 photo of the inside of my Samlex EVO-4024 Low Frequency Inverter / Charger.
All that copper makes them weight a ton... well ok 30 Kg so not a ton but a PITA to mount on a wall when alone !
APC 3024 top side..jpgAPC-3024 underside.jpgAPC-3024 upper.jpgSamlex-evo-4024 Top Face.jpg
 
Steve, Thanks but no thanks for offer of dead inverters.

The specs on the smallest Yiyen unit are impressive. I don't have as much problem buying Chinese produced stuff.. I'm old enough to remember when all Japanese made goods were considered inferior. I probably will ask for a quote if for no other reason than to know.

Do you still live off grid? or is this a back up for if/when? I too built my own home...took four years but I was learning as I went. That was 30 years ago.
 
Ohhh I live offgrid out in a mixed coniferous forest but I'm on south face top of a ridge over 3 valley's. My Samlex is my main inverter, I keep the Yiyen as a backup just in case. I have 3 backups for everything ! it's an ex-mil thing.

Ohh Yeah on the JA-Pan Co of the 70's shtick and then the Korean stuff got it... along with others. What irks me, is take Power Tools for example. Black & Decker, Porter Cable, DeWalt, all owned by one holding company, all designed by same engineers, all subcontracted to factories in China who build to the specs of the designers... It's not the sub-contractors job to point out what's junk. B&D = Crap now, P.C. = good homeowner tools, DeWalt Better Homeowner & Good Pro Tools. But everyone blames the Chinese, they just sub-contract and bid on specs provided by the label owners. Same happened with Japanese, Korean and everyone else's stuff too. Then there are VARS (value added resellers) like Aims Co, they buy to their spec & mods from OEMS (Original Equipment Manufacturers) in China and they get what suits their target market, that can be tricky as there are good & bad VARS out there.
 
Steve_S said:
I had to download that, PEREFCT ! Thanks what a great tune ! Thank goodness for YoutubeDL
Click to expand...

This was one of my 'goto' songs back in the 70's, always struck a cord with me too. Wishful thinking on my part. As soon as I saw your post, I immediately thought of this song.
 
Steve_S said:
$$ difference is the first thing that everyone notices, funny how a persons wallet can cringe eh ! Hmmm Smart Wallet ?
I have a few dead HF Inverters if you wanna pay for shipping, even a King 3Kw Inverter Generator (Crappy HF blew up), they are scrap though and not much point, irreparable. How did I kill them, Table Saw, Compressor, Chop Saw (all while I was building my home, just to add to the $ misery). I got an LF 3Kw Yiyen "Cheapo Chinese" and that took it all and never blinked but the 30Lb Copper Coil had a lot to do with that I'm pretty sure, it is now my backup Inverter/Charger. REF: https://www.yiyen.com/product/apc-series-pure-sine-wave-inverter-charger/ I bought mine from a Marine Supply house for 650 USD ? or thereabouts. I'm now using a Samlex EVO-4024 but that is quite a bit more cash but features & functions and communications with it +++
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Steve, I sent an inquiry to Yiyen for prices and data on their APC units. I received a reply this morning:

"Glad to receive your message.
This is Allen sales manager from YIY company.

For the APC series 1000W 24Vdc 220Vac EXW price is 150USD (MOQ: 2 PCS)
APC series 1500W 24Vdc 220Vac EXW price is 185USD (MOQ: 2 PCS)

Could you please tell me how many pcs you need ?

And please check the attached for the details."

The specifications and capabilities of these units are fairly impressive. I have tried to add the attached pdf file but it keeps including my personal email address.
So here is a link to the Yiyen product line:
www.yiyen.com

Off-Grid Inverter Selection Guide - YIY | Yiyen Electric

www.yiyen.com

The EXW price is the price exclusive of shipping, customs etc.. The MOQ is "Minimum Order Quantity". Also these prices are for the 220 version (which I failed to specify in my original request for information. the prices for a 120 AC may be different).
The minimum order should be small problem for those of us who also follow the old military axiom of "two is one and one is none". I will see what I can find out about shipping costs. What with the asked prices for similar units off the shelf here in the US these would seem to be worth looking into.
 
I purchased mine from a Sailboat Enthusiast site in Montreal and he had it drop shipped to my door.
Translated to English: https://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=fr&u=http://energie-abordable.com/&prev=search

YIY is an OEM I don't think they sell directly to the everyday end user but I know there are many resellers and they are available on ebay, amazon and aliexpress etc. I believe I saw them on Bangood as well.

Alibaba: https://cnyiy.en.alibaba.com/produc....html?spm=a2700.icbuShop.88.34.7ef21026TDfVuc
 
When asked, ChatGPT just told me that my 2014 Toyota Camry does not have a pure sine wave. How times have changed in 2023!
 
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