I'm looking at a 6KW single story 15x400W panel installation with a Ecoflow Ultra 18Kw setup. does anyone have recent installation experience in the area. I heard that there're no solar panel only rebate but there's a 30% rebate for solar battery installs. Is that correct and if so, anyone got some handy links? TIA
Rough Solar panel installation cost in San Jose and any rebate still available?
- Thread starter Wiz33
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chrisski
Solar Boondocker
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I like https://www.solarreviews.com/ for more info
Not in CA, but The 30% rebate is federal.
I got that for panel, installation, and batteries for a 2023 tax year.. Not a generator plug.
$15k per 5 kw system is reasonable.
I would expect 18 kw of battery to be around $20k installed.
Not in CA, but The 30% rebate is federal.
I got that for panel, installation, and batteries for a 2023 tax year.. Not a generator plug.
$15k per 5 kw system is reasonable.
I would expect 18 kw of battery to be around $20k installed.
Thanks, some search result I found say $2.95/W in my area which lines up with your estimate, what I don't understand is that why it's not per panel and I assume that there should be minimal labor difference installing panels of different wattage. I'm looking at the Ecoflow Delta pro Ultra with 3 batteries and a Smart Panel 2 on sale at Costco for $9999. Figure $2K-$2.5K for install. If I can keep the project at ~$20K after rebate/credit. I'm fine.
hwy17
Anti-Solar Enthusiast
You will probably not find a pro installer who wants to work with your ecoflow.
If you want pro install you will be stuck with Tesla, Enphase, etc.
Ecoflow is having a rep at some of our local Costco in a week or so, I'm sure they have installer that work with their system. Worse case, I'll just have the solar installer drop the PV line to where my Ecoflow will be located then just plug them in after I have an electrician comes in to install the Smart panel 2.
hwy17
Anti-Solar Enthusiast
You will have trouble with permits for that if you're trying to get it permitted.
Hedges
I See Electromagnetic Fields!
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Because it is not contract labor. It is a bundle sold and installed by a company.
They may compute a price for a system, or they may just calculate a price based on wattage rating.
There is a complexity to pricing models, and that gets distilled down to equations in software.
Similar when I ordered kitchen cabinets from Home Depo. Any option, e.g. "furniture plywood ends", is simply priced as a percentage multiplier on the entire order.
These projects are far to small to price out each component and each labor step.
You can't get anyone to just install an array for you.
An array would not be code compliant, and permits would not be available. You need a "rapid shut down" system, which is the integration of module-level power electronics, an inverter with keep-alive transmitter, a switch or RSD button to activate it.
About the only choices you have are to order off the menu offered by a solar company,
or design a system, create drawings, apply for permits, and install it either yourself or with people who are technically our employees.
Not likely you can get any contractor or electrician to do any of the work.
You could buy a complete installed grid-tie system with string inverter, then disconnect their invertor and connect yours. But you would need to know the PV array design, that it was compatible with your hardware. And you would need to get the RSD keep-alive working.
Well, if the manufacturer or rep at Costco can refer you to an installer, then you're in luck.
EcoFlow DELTA Pro Ultra - EcoFlow
us.ecoflow.com
"For CA/TX Homeowners only, check the new exclusive bundle included installation fee below to enjoy an end-to-end order to installation service"
Don't know if that includes the PV you're looking for, however.
I think this is just a battery backup (UPS) system.
"The most powerful whole-home backup solution
-7.2kW-21.6kW output with up to 3 inverters
-Up to 90kWh capacity with 3 inverters and 15 batteries
-5.6kW-16.8kW solar input with up to 3 inverters
-Online UPS, 0-ms transfer time
-LFP battery"
You're probably better off determining what functions and capacity you want, then selecting a system which offers that and has installation companies in the area.
robbob2112
Doing more research, mosty harmless
Do a few searches on the ecoflow units here and using a larger solar bank than what they supply as a kit. There are many horror stories of either brain dead or melted units. I have no first hand experience with the units, but I did look at them pretty well a while back and rejected them for the issues they had at the time.
zanydroid
Solar Wizard
Don't buy anything without city permits and interconnection agreement in hand.
The people at desk in Costco are salespeople. You need a written estimate, at least, before mentally committing to a plan.
Prior to NEM2->NEM3 transition you have to be a contractor (so know how to deal with solar folks as subcontractors)/have good connections to get the "PV line dropped where I want" level of service, since the default for residential customer (unless you know how to talk to them, which I sure couldn't figure out in 3 hours of being on the phone and way more hours of that asking for advice on multiple forums) is turnkey. Even some small scale builders on solar forums, that have experience dealing with subs, didn't get much beyond homeowner-style contract.
For anything Smart in its name in permanent infrastructure, you have to game out the lifecycle risks like the company going belly-up or the software being terrible. Worst case, it will have to be tossed out. My personal rule is, only accept smart components from massive new companies or from traditional electrical suppliers like Leviton/Eaton.
Ecoflow is offering free install in CA and TX if purchased directly from their site. I'm sure they have certified installer that can get the needed permits.
zanydroid
Solar Wizard
Does this require you to pay for and take delivery of the product before locking down a contract with the local vendor? Maybe or maybe not.
There's a lot of weasel language in the fine print.
hwy17
Anti-Solar Enthusiast
Well I hope they revolutionize the market then. I think they'd end up backing out of that and refunding me if they tried to deal with Santa Cruz AHJ. San Jose is not so bad from what I hear. If you try this, please report back to us with the results.
zanydroid
Solar Wizard
Either overly optimistic (see the fine language) or a significant market disruption on their part from the conventional wisdom on how things are done.
If you want to be the stalking horse and take the heat / boon from trying this out for us, that would be nice. Somebody has to do it.
BTW several people on this thread (including myself) self-installed in Bay Area with full permits during NEM2->NEM3 transition, so the experience is pretty current (<1.5 years). And are pretty familiar with AHJ and solar code as a result.
oops, not free install but with install included at $1500.
hwy17
Anti-Solar Enthusiast
Still a great deal if it's true.
zanydroid
Solar Wizard
You need to be very careful with the details as to whether the $1500 includes just mounting the transfer switch and combiner box for the outputs from the EcoFlow Ultra units (that's about normal price, and this scope of change/type of hardware I can believe is all UL-listed equipment that can be permitted).
Or it includes mounting the panels / installing conduit (impossible). I have a hard time believing that the Ultra is UL9540 listed / designed for permanent DC tie-in to solar panels. And that for me would be the starting point of research for a project like this.
FWIW my guess is pictures you find of EcoFlow Ultra connection to PV online will show flexible PV cable going into the side of the device, which would not be code compliant since the minimum standard indoors would be flexible metal conduit into a junction box.
Or it includes mounting the panels / installing conduit (impossible). I have a hard time believing that the Ultra is UL9540 listed / designed for permanent DC tie-in to solar panels. And that for me would be the starting point of research for a project like this.
FWIW my guess is pictures you find of EcoFlow Ultra connection to PV online will show flexible PV cable going into the side of the device, which would not be code compliant since the minimum standard indoors would be flexible metal conduit into a junction box.
zanydroid
Solar Wizard
Does 6kW / your electric bill size qualify for SunWork.Org? Though, IIRC from going through their training (1 year out, so my memory is swiss cheesed) they install AC microinverter systems.
WRT anything like Anker or EcoFlow, the likely situation is that you end up with being able to easily install and permit an AC backup system that charges from grid. This is legal under my understanding of California code (since a backup system is not an Energy Storage System, which has heavy handed code and equipment certification).
And TBH if your ambitions stopped at grid charged AC backup (no solar) I wouldn't be as annoying with my replies. Go for it. It's in the sweet spot of these ecoflows' capability/core competency.
Setting aside the likely incompatibility between EcoFlow to code-compliant permanent DC wiring, it will be hard to get someone to do panels the way you've talked about, unless solar installers are so desperate after NEM3. There has not been enough threads on contractor hiring in NEM3 for DIY-assist for us to know for sure what the vibe is. IMO it's too early for them to get this desperate, they're only now wrapping up their NEM2 installation backlog.
As for heavy, easy to move batteries. Battery stacks similar to EcoFlow (a reasonable ~50-75 lb per slab in the stack) are fully designed and shipping out of China, but I haven't kept up with which permanent inverters support them. The recent innovation that has made it through the full product development lifespan / into these forums / accepted b y AHJ has been in large 300 lb wall mount batteries. A shame because a lot of folks here, myself included, like the outdoor rated battery stack form factor more for easy of installation.
WRT anything like Anker or EcoFlow, the likely situation is that you end up with being able to easily install and permit an AC backup system that charges from grid. This is legal under my understanding of California code (since a backup system is not an Energy Storage System, which has heavy handed code and equipment certification).
And TBH if your ambitions stopped at grid charged AC backup (no solar) I wouldn't be as annoying with my replies. Go for it. It's in the sweet spot of these ecoflows' capability/core competency.
Setting aside the likely incompatibility between EcoFlow to code-compliant permanent DC wiring, it will be hard to get someone to do panels the way you've talked about, unless solar installers are so desperate after NEM3. There has not been enough threads on contractor hiring in NEM3 for DIY-assist for us to know for sure what the vibe is. IMO it's too early for them to get this desperate, they're only now wrapping up their NEM2 installation backlog.
As for heavy, easy to move batteries. Battery stacks similar to EcoFlow (a reasonable ~50-75 lb per slab in the stack) are fully designed and shipping out of China, but I haven't kept up with which permanent inverters support them. The recent innovation that has made it through the full product development lifespan / into these forums / accepted b y AHJ has been in large 300 lb wall mount batteries. A shame because a lot of folks here, myself included, like the outdoor rated battery stack form factor more for easy of installation.
I sure it's the most basic install just attach it right next to your existing panel and anything like relocating the input box to where you ultra is located or mounting the panel inside the garage (existing panel is outside the garage) will be extra.
zanydroid
Solar Wizard
Yeah.
TBH you probably could have hired an electrician to do this tie in, just annoying to make the calls and talk over the details. Referral service (which basically is what is going on here) is good provided the premium is not that much.
Going through a garage wall to a new panel is not that bad.
When picking location for battery stack you want to be mindful of where they are relative to vehicle path. ESS code is very specific about the paths and requires bollards/barriers when ESS batteries are placed along some vectors. Even if you are not held to those standards for your install you want to be aware of them and make a conscious decision about those risks.
Since I have have a fairly large backyard that have minimal shading in the area furthest from the house with good sun angle. I think the simplest way is to get a planning permit and install a ground level 7S2P setup using 440W panels which also have the advantage of easy cleaning, repair and I can take the panels with me when I downsize to our other house (currently rented out) which I'll have to do a rooftop setup.
