eg4 communications hub with Schneider insight home

[n2aws]

Hi all,

TL;DR: comms hub loses communications with inverter, then reconnects. Rinse/repeat. More details about the configuration and setup below.

I've got 6 Lifepower4 batteries. I've been doing closed loop communications with an insight home, ever since the original firmware update became available. I've had no issues with this, for months.

I had the "top" (as in, physically the top battery in the rack) set to ID 0, I skipped ID 1 (as that kills comms with the inverter) and set the rest of the packs sequentially. so the resulting ID's are: 0,2,3,4,5,6. Again, this has worked flawlessly for months.

EG4 released a communications hub that gives a visual display of each battery without needing to lug my laptop out there, disconnect the inverter, and plug in the USB cable for BMSTest. It was inexpensive, so I picked one up.

I went through the comms hub, and changed the inverter RS485 protocol to "Schneider", I set my top battery (that used to be 0) to ID 1. I've confirmed in BMS_Test that it can communicate with the entire stack, and get the data. I then unplug the RS485-to-USB adapter, and plug the top battery into "Bat1" on the RS-485 side of the communications hub. The display on the hub updates, and shows I have 6 packs. Perfectly fine, and expected.

I move the comms cable from the insight home, to the "INV" port on the RS485 side of the comms hub. I go to the insight local page, detect devices, IDs 1-10, it finds 1, and the comms hub shows up as a battery BMS. awesome. Everything sounds great, right?

This is the part I can't figure out.
Every minute or so, the insight shows a BMS communications timeout, and the BMS is "offline"
Then a few moments later, it's online again. rinse/repeat indefinitely.

I thought maybe I damaged the cable, or loosened the connection to the insight home. But, everything checks out. When I revert the settings and remove the comms hub from the picture and go back to just communicating with the batteries, it's rock solid again.

Has anyone experienced similar? What am I missing?

 

[Old_Skewler]

I am not sure what is happening with your setup. I will say that I use pin #1 on my setup with 3 batteries and things are working fine, despite having also read somewhere that you must skip #1. I haven't and unless something stops working, I will not skip pin #1. Maybe it is worth trying NOT skipping it and see if fix things up.

I'd like to ask you about the paragraph below:

EG4 released a communications hub that gives a visual display of each battery without needing to lug my laptop out there, disconnect the inverter, and plug in the USB cable for BMSTest. It was inexpensive, so I picked one up.

I was not able to find the hub you mentioned under Signature Solar. Could you post a link to it? I've love to access the battery BMS without having to disconnect Insight Home.

Thanks and good luck!

 

[n2aws]

I am not sure what is happening with your setup. I will say that I use pin #1 on my setup with 3 batteries and things are working fine, despite having also read somewhere that you must skip #1. I haven't and unless something stops working, I will not skip pin #1. Maybe it is worth trying NOT skipping it and see if fix things up.

I'd like to ask you about the paragraph below:



I was not able to find the hub you mentioned under Signature Solar. Could you post a link to it? I've love to access the battery BMS without having to disconnect Insight Home.

Thanks and good luck!

This is the lifepower4 communications hub: https://signaturesolar.com/EG4-LiFePOWER4-Communications-Hub

Yeah, it's odd. InsightLocal shows the comms hub disconnected about 50% of the time. and when it does, the inverter throws a fault that requires me to manually clear it. I've done a ton of testing now. If I remove all the battery packs but one, AND.. reglardless of how I set the dipswitches (I've tried with ID 1,3,6,12). it does the same thing. The comms hub shows 1 pack connected. it sends SOC and current/etc to the insight.. then.. drops the connection.. and then it works again. (For some definition of the word "works" because, as I mentioned.. I have to manually clear the fault)

When I reset everything back to the old setup (insight connected to battery ID 0). the comms are 100% stable. but of course.. I can't have to "ID 0" devices on the bus, so it makes the comms hub useless.

@Markus_SignatureSolar Have you got any thoughts, just out of curiosity?

 

[LithiumCowboy]

I have alot of experience with the Schneider ecosystem and the eg4 com-hub.
What firmware are you using on the com-hub?
What firmware on the battery?
What firmware on the insight home?

 

[Markus_EG4]

This is the lifepower4 communications hub: https://signaturesolar.com/EG4-LiFePOWER4-Communications-Hub

Yeah, it's odd. InsightLocal shows the comms hub disconnected about 50% of the time. and when it does, the inverter throws a fault that requires me to manually clear it. I've done a ton of testing now. If I remove all the battery packs but one, AND.. reglardless of how I set the dipswitches (I've tried with ID 1,3,6,12). it does the same thing. The comms hub shows 1 pack connected. it sends SOC and current/etc to the insight.. then.. drops the connection.. and then it works again. (For some definition of the word "works" because, as I mentioned.. I have to manually clear the fault)

When I reset everything back to the old setup (insight connected to battery ID 0). the comms are 100% stable. but of course.. I can't have to "ID 0" devices on the bus, so it makes the comms hub useless.

@Markus_SignatureSolar Have you got any thoughts, just out of curiosity?

What firmware are you using for the comms hub. We have figured out Schneider systems need a special firmware from all the rest of the inverters to work properly

 

[Markus_EG4]

There will be a comms hub update coming out very soon for the Schneider system. Just for Schneider

 

[n2aws]

I have alot of experience with the Schneider ecosystem and the eg4 com-hub.
What firmware are you using on the com-hub?
What firmware on the battery?
What firmware on the insight home?

Hub, 1.6
Battery. 3.21 for Schneider (when bmstest connects, it says 3.10, though)
Insight 1.17, and tried with 1.18. But went back to 1.17 since they pulled 1.18 without explanation

 

[n2aws]

There will be a comms hub update coming out very soon for the Schneider system. Just for Schneider

This is good to know. I'll stop fighting with it for now until I see the update.

If you need a beta tester, feel free to message me. I'm familiar with software QA

 

[n2aws]

This is good to know. I'll stop fighting with it for now until I see the update.

If you need a beta tester, feel free to message me. I'm familiar with software QA

I saw.a new firmware published to the eg4 downloads page for the comms hub. I didn't see it the other day when posting this thread, so I assume it's the new firmware that @Markus_SignatureSolar mentioned above. However, even with 1.10 on the communications hub, the issue still remains.

 

[Markus_EG4]

Sounds like you have a bad connection on the insight home or some settings not matching. we have tested this for 3 weeks straight no with now issues. Pm me your settings I can check them for you but i would defiantly check the cable you are using.

 

[n2aws]

Sounds like you have a bad connection on the insight home or some settings not matching. we have tested this for 3 weeks straight no with now issues. Pm me your settings I can check them for you but i would defiantly check the cable you are using.

The cable works 100% when I remove the communications hub, and plug it directly back into the battery (and set the battery back to ID 0, obviously)

I'll DM you.

 

[n2aws]

Just so this thread doesn't just die without any explanation like so many others:

@Markus_SignatureSolar Had me try a couple things after taking the time to understand how I had everything setup/connected.
At the end of it, It's looking like this is going to be an RMA of the communications hub.

I'll update this thread later when the new hardware has arrived. In the meantime, I've now interacted with signature solar 3 times for "support" type stuff. In one, they were a little slow to respond (and admittedly said they were overwhelmed at the time). but so far, all of the experiences have been positive. I know on a public forum you are going to get mixed reviews, so chalk my reviews-to-date up as a positive.

 

[n2aws]

Just so this thread doesn't just die without any explanation like so many others:

@Markus_SignatureSolar Had me try a couple things after taking the time to understand how I had everything setup/connected.
At the end of it, It's looking like this is going to be an RMA of the communications hub.

I'll update this thread later when the new hardware has arrived. In the meantime, I've now interacted with signature solar 3 times for "support" type stuff. In one, they were a little slow to respond (and admittedly said they were overwhelmed at the time). but so far, all of the experiences have been positive. I know on a public forum you are going to get mixed reviews, so chalk my reviews-to-date up as a positive.

As promised, here is an update:

New communications hub arrived. It was on firmware version 1.6.

I connected it to my insight home via the *same* cable I use without issues on the LifePower4 stack of batteries directly.
It continued to exhibit the same behavior where the inverter/insight reports lost comms with the battery, and then eventually works again. Then loses comms again.. ad nauseum. Rinse and repeat after an update to 1.10 on the comms hub, and there is no change in behavior.

I'd love to hear from other schneider users who also have the LifePower4 communications hub. Is it working for you? If so, would you mind reporting the firmware versions you are using for the following components:

Battery
Communications Hub
Insight Home
XW Pro

Here, you can see the comms are fine when connected directly to the 6 Lifepower4 batteries. The at 7:00 (UTC) I disconnected it, and plugged in the communications hub. I left it plugged in for several hours, and you can see the *constant* connects/disconnects where SOC shows 0% and then whatever the real state is..



Here are the message I get in the insight home, when I click on the inverter "Events" tab: Note, it doesn't log when the connection is re-established.



Signature solar was quick to replace the hardware, and @Markus_SignatureSolar has tried to help me diagnose it a couple of times before sending the replacement hardware out. So, I have to give them credit. I've read stories on here about the lack of support, but I've had the opposite experience.


That said, I'd really like to know if anyone is successfully using the communications hub in their environment.

 

[n2aws]

Resolved:

Worked a bit more with Markus, and he asked a few questions that lead to me doing some more troubleshooting. The steps I took were:

#1) powered communications hub off
#2) Push both dip switches to the down position
#3) With comms hub powered off, I logged into insight home, and deleted the existing BMS
#4) rebooted insight home
#5) Powered communications hub back on
#6) Logged into insight home, and did another modbus device scan
#7) Waited.

Their have been no more disconnects.
I'm not sure if *just* changing the DIP switches would have been enough. I did that earlier, but *maybe* I just didn't wait long enough.
I did suggest that the PDF get updated, explaining what the DIP switches are for, and how to set them. Though to be fair, I made a bad assumption: Due to the orientation of th switches next to the CAM ports, I mistakenly assumed it wasn't for the modbus/rs-485, So I didn't even try changing them for any of my troubleshooting steps.


Once again, major kudos to signature solar, and Markus for the ongoing support.

 

[Solar Chuchin]

Resolved:

Worked a bit more with Markus, and he asked a few questions that lead to me doing some more troubleshooting. The steps I took were:

#1) powered communications hub off
#2) Push both dip switches to the down position
#3) With comms hub powered off, I logged into insight home, and deleted the existing BMS
#4) rebooted insight home
#5) Powered communications hub back on
#6) Logged into insight home, and did another modbus device scan
#7) Waited.

Their have been no more disconnects.
I'm not sure if *just* changing the DIP switches would have been enough. I did that earlier, but *maybe* I just didn't wait long enough.
I did suggest that the PDF get updated, explaining what the DIP switches are for, and how to set them. Though to be fair, I made a bad assumption: Due to the orientation of th switches next to the CAM ports, I mistakenly assumed it wasn't for the modbus/rs-485, So I didn't even try changing them for any of my troubleshooting steps.


Once again, major kudos to signature solar, and Markus for the ongoing support.

Hey n2aws, I am trying to do the same setup you have, I have 4 lifepower batteries, the comms hub in which i can see my 4 batteries with addresses from 1 to 4. I just bought the insight home and updated it, im in the process of updating my xantrex 6048 as well (havent done it yet). However, i noticed that to connect to the insight home some people connect the two cables (orange and orange white) from the cat 5s to the plug on the insight home. But is this for batteries that are conected to the insight home directly? Im under the impression that you are conecting from the hub to the insight with a cat5 to cat5, is this right, and if so, where do i connect the insight to the hub on can1(inv) or rs-485-3(inv)? im a bit confused and am affraid to mess it all up before it even works... Id appreciate some guidance please... I really want to see SOC on my xantrex 6048....

 

[n2aws]

Hey n2aws, I am trying to do the same setup you have, I have 4 lifepower batteries, the comms hub in which i can see my 4 batteries with addresses from 1 to 4. I just bought the insight home and updated it, im in the process of updating my xantrex 6048 as well (havent done it yet). However, i noticed that to connect to the insight home some people connect the two cables (orange and orange white) from the cat 5s to the plug on the insight home. But is this for batteries that are conected to the insight home directly? Im under the impression that you are conecting from the hub to the insight with a cat5 to cat5, is this right, and if so, where do i connect the insight to the hub on can1(inv) or rs-485-3(inv)? im a bit confused and am affraid to mess it all up before it even works... Id appreciate some guidance please... I really want to see SOC on my xantrex 6048....

So, you have it slightly backwards.
1) you use standard cat5 to plug the lifepower4 battery into the hub
2) you use standard cat5 to plug the inverter into the insight device
3) you cut a standard cat5 cable, and wire orange and orange/white to the RS485 terminals on the insight, the side witht he RJ485 intact, plugs into the right-most "INV" port on the hub
4) In my case, both dipsitches had to be in the "down" position if looking at the ports on the hub, with the display facing up. EG4/Signature Solar haven't yet documented the purpose of the DIP switches, or how the addresses it sets correlate to either the xanbus network, or the battery comms, or whatever it does, so this may require some trial and error on your side.

 

[Solar Chuchin]

So, you have it slightly backwards.
1) you use standard cat5 to plug the lifepower4 battery into the hub
2) you use standard cat5 to plug the inverter into the insight device
3) you cut a standard cat5 cable, and wire orange and orange/white to the RS485 terminals on the insight, the side witht he RJ485 intact, plugs into the right-most "INV" port on the hub
4) In my case, both dipsitches had to be in the "down" position if looking at the ports on the hub, with the display facing up. EG4/Signature Solar haven't yet documented the purpose of the DIP switches, or how the addresses it sets correlate to either the xanbus network, or the battery comms, or whatever it does, so this may require some trial and error on your side.

yes, cat5 from xabus to xambus from inverter to insight home, cat5 from eg4 hub inv 485-3 port to orange/orange white cable to the left top side of plug provided by insight home. I can see the unit through insight, but when i tried to update the inverter, i cant go past 8% and it stops to give the message that its not compatible with the file... So i cant change some settings on the insight, cause the inverter isnt updated (like for lithium batteries)... by the way. i also changed the dip switches just to follow what you were doing...

 

[n2aws]

yes, cat5 from xabus to xambus from inverter to insight home, cat5 from eg4 hub inv 485-3 port to orange/orange white cable to the left top side of plug provided by insight home. I can see the unit through insight, but when i tried to update the inverter, i cant go past 8% and it stops to give the message that its not compatible with the file... So i cant change some settings on the insight, cause the inverter isnt updated (like for lithium batteries)... by the way. i also changed the dip switches just to follow what you were doing...

when you say

I can see the unit through insight, but when i tried to update the inverter, i cant go past 8% and it stops to give the message that its not compatible with the file...

What does this mean? If you are talking about a firmware update, this would have nothing to do with the hub, or the xanbus/RS485 connection.

If you are talking about something else, I'll need clarification. Can yuo include a screenshot of the 8% error message you mentioned?

 

[Solar Chuchin]

when you say


What does this mean? If you are talking about a firmware update, this would have nothing to do with the hub, or the xanbus/RS485 connection.

If you are talking about something else, I'll need clarification. Can yuo include a screenshot of the 8% error message you mentioned?

By reading your posts, i followed what you did (including the two dip switches on the eg4 hub). So i think im good there cause i can open the insight home and i can view my devices including the eg4 hub which shows as a bms. So seeing as i am able to view all this, i then continued on to try and update my xantrex inverter with the xw pro 120/240 files provided on the site. This did not work, both files that are on the site failed. Have you managed to update your xantrex inverter? I have version 1.07.00bn3 if im not mistaking…. So in my inverter settings i only see settings for flooded, gel, agm and custom… So i cant set them through the insight home settings cause the inverter doesnt accept (until the update is performed). Anything i can do to update the inverter? Is there another way?

 

[n2aws]

By reading your posts, i followed what you did (including the two dip switches on the eg4 hub). So i think im good there cause i can open the insight home and i can view my devices including the eg4 hub which shows as a bms. So seeing as i am able to view all this, i then continued on to try and update my xantrex inverter with the xw pro 120/240 files provided on the site. This did not work, both files that are on the site failed. Have you managed to update your xantrex inverter? I have version 1.07.00bn3 if im not mistaking…. So in my inverter settings i only see settings for flooded, gel, agm and custom… So i cant set them through the insight home settings cause the inverter doesnt accept (until the update is performed). Anything i can do to update the inverter? Is there another way?

To be clear, xantrax inverters are no longer made. Xantrax was acquired by Schneider years ago. Do you actually have an old Xantrax inverter, or do you have an XW pro? (or one of the other inverters)

I doubt the xw pro firmwares will work on the xantrax inverters. If you actually have xantrax inverters, you need to see if they have updated firmwares for those, or contact schnieder potentially.