EG4 6500ex 79.71

[dmkjr]

I've read the changelogs, "1. Add N-G relay control function. The setting 42 to disable, the relay will short input and output neutral always as following “C” block. The setting 42 is disable, the relay will close on ground or floating side when inverter work in Battery mode as following “A and B” block. The default setting is disable."

Could someone give us the benefit of this firmware? Will this stop or attempt to stop the light flicker? Was that the problem that this was targeting? While I build my own system, I'll stick with the network engineering and leave the electrical stuff to your crazies.

 

[Adam De Lay]

My assumption is that all this update does is get rid of the need for two separate firmware update files (stationary vs mobile) by adding a N/G Relay option to the menu allowing for selection based on each individuals specific environment.

 

[dmkjr]

Makes sense since the two firmware files have been removed and just has one.

 

[Zwy]

I've read the changelogs, "1. Add N-G relay control function. The setting 42 to disable, the relay will short input and output neutral always as following “C” block. The setting 42 is disable, the relay will close on ground or floating side when inverter work in Battery mode as following “A and B” block. The default setting is disable."

Could someone give us the benefit of this firmware? Will this stop or attempt to stop the light flicker? Was that the problem that this was targeting? While I build my own system, I'll stick with the network engineering and leave the electrical stuff to your crazies.

After spending a few months trying to eliminate light flicker which was caused by voltage fluctuations using a pair of EG4 6500EX's, I installed a pair of LV6548's with one bonding screw removed and no firmware updates so one LV6548 creates N-G bond. I have not had any light flicker.

I have some videos in the forums here where it shows up to 7V potential between neutral and ground in the loads panel when the inverter voltage output would fluctuate and lights would strobe with the 6500EX's installed. Also some discussion, start here. The voltage fluctuation would occur randomly to an extent, it was usually some type of change in load that would set it off and when adding load during the strobe it many times would disappear.

The only difference concerning grounding on these inverters installed on my system is the LV6548's bond N-G and switch neutral. I did try the mobile firmware on the 6500EX's with one bonding screw but it did not resolve the problem. I then went with stationary firmware and no bonding screws, each step away from inverter bonding N-G made it worse.

Replacement 6500EX's with no bonding screws and 79.70 firmware caused the led lights to glow with the light switch off. I did try bonding the loads panel but still had some light strobe.

I would assume this latest firmware is an attempt to allow a choice of inverter bonding and switching neutral. The latter is important concerning objectionable current.

I have not had a single problem with light flicker/strobe since installing the LV6548's nor have I seen any output voltage fluctuation. It is a hardware problem in the 6500EX and I have to give Signature Solar credit for trying to find a solution using firmware. The 6500EX could be a great product with the high VOC rating and plenty of inverter output to run a household. This has been a problem for some time, this addition to the firmware would provide a way for the customer to try various options to eliminate the light flicker/strobe. Maybe the firmware will be successful at overcoming the hardware deficiency. If it does, it will be a very good product.

 

[jmjack]

I don't think this FW update was planned out well. I see three areas of confusion here.

1. The dynamic bonding via the menu 42 option won't work properly to make the bond unless a bond screw is installed. What about all those inverters that were shipped without a bonding screw? Now it appears all inverters should ship with the screw installed since option 42 is available.
2. The bond appears to enable by selecting disable in menu item 42. Does this seems backwards to common sense?
3. In the PPT file that comes with the firmware download it shows testing continuity between N and G at the inverter AC output. This will only give an accurate reading with the wires not attached because many may have a N-G bond somewhere else in the system when using AC input on a shared N setup. This is not explained at all.

Just my .02....

 

[BraydenFromEG4]

1. The dynamic bonding via the menu 42 option won't work properly to make the bond unless a bond screw is installed. What about all those inverters that were shipped without a bonding screw? Now it appears all inverters should ship with the screw installed since option 42 is available.

Those who planned on using the mobile firmware (what is now the "Disabled" setting) still need to contact their distributor for guidance on reinstalling the screw (for warranty purposes and the like). Since the primary use case for this inverter still tends to be in stationary settings, this won't affect too many people, but we will likely move back to keeping the screws in at some point for the convenience of the end user.

2. The bond appears to enable by selecting disable in menu item 42. Does this seems backwards to common sense?

The "Enable/Disable" does come across as unintuitive if you think about the setting strictly as "NG-bond", but it more accurately describes the bypass. Enabling the bypass shorts the in-out neutrals, which is the big takeaway from the setting as that gives access to an upstream NG-bond, while opening the path to the grounding screw preventing parallel pathing.

3. In the PPT file that comes with the firmware download it shows testing continuity between N and G at the inverter AC output. This will only give an accurate reading with the wires not attached because many may have a N-G bond somewhere else in the system when using AC input on a shared N setup. This is not explained at all.

This can definitely be a concern if you're testing a system that is already installed, but the PowerPoint isn't meant to be a particularly detailed guide. Rather, a quick reference to show how to test the setting.

You have some valid points, and my clarification was probably unnecessary. Hopefully if anyone is confused and stumbles on this, they'll get some insight into the benefits that this update brings, as up until now Mobile users who have had some issues resolved by newer firmware have not been able to use it. I've put out a video as well on the update with tests/clarifications here:

 

[Adam De Lay]

Those who planned on using the mobile firmware (what is now the "Disabled" setting) still need to contact their distributor for guidance on reinstalling the screw (for warranty purposes and the like). Since the primary use case for this inverter still tends to be in stationary settings, this won't affect too many people, but we will likely move back to keeping the screws in at some point for the convenience of the end user.

The "Enable/Disable" does come across as unintuitive if you think about the setting strictly as "NG-bond", but it more accurately describes the bypass. Enabling the bypass shorts the in-out neutrals, which is the big takeaway from the setting as that gives access to an upstream NG-bond, while opening the path to the grounding screw preventing parallel pathing.

This can definitely be a concern if you're testing a system that is already installed, but the PowerPoint isn't meant to be a particularly detailed guide. Rather, a quick reference to show how to test the setting.

You have some valid points, and my clarification was probably unnecessary. Hopefully if anyone is confused and stumbles on this, they'll get some insight into the benefits that this update brings, as up until now Mobile users who have had some issues resolved by newer firmware have not been able to use it. I've put out a video as well on the update with tests/clarifications here:

Are there plans to update the manual with the new version? When I attempted to update and figure out what was going on, the changelog and ppt seemed to confuse the issue even more.

Why not stick with the terminology created when you had 2 different firmware files?
Option 42 - Environment - Select "S7A" or "NOB" (trying to think of values you could use on the inverter which somewhat reflect the actual letters).