EV Network issues and a possible fix? A thought experiment...

[timselectric]

I would fully charge nightly at home. But, I need reliable and easy access to charging away from home, too.

 

[timselectric]

Idk man looks like a ton everywhere. My daughter is just starting at UK and I'm trying to convince her to let me get her a model3

I just installed plushare. My results are nothing like yours.
It appears that you have zero filters selected. Which is a very misleading representation. You are showing all private, restricted access, coming soon, and level 2 chargers.
This is what it shows me for fast chargers, around Louisville. (Your 3rd picture)

 

[justinm001]

I just installed plushare. My results are nothing like yours.
It appears that you have zero filters selected. Which is a very misleading representation. You are showing all private, restricted access, coming soon, and level 2 chargers.
This is what it shows me for fast chargers, around Louisville. (Your 3rd picture)

Private was removed, very few restricted are actually restricted and there's like 1 coming soon in Louisville.
Level2 is by far the majority. The point in EV charging is to charge at the destination not on the way. You go to the mall or a restaurant and you plug in. Out of town pick a hotel with a charger. If you're able to charge 25% or 75 miles in an hour that'll last a couple days for most and it's right there.

It's very rare that people drive hundreds of miles a day. That's 36k miles per year, they structure leases at 10,12,15k max because that fits 90% of drivers. It's rare a 3 year old car has 100k miles on it. Now I drive a lot, like over 50k a year but I have a bunch of cars and pick the one that fits my needs for that trip.

 

[timselectric]

Private was removed, very few restricted are actually restricted and there's like 1 coming soon in Louisville.
Level2 is by far the majority. The point in EV charging is to charge at the destination not on the way. You go to the mall or a restaurant and you plug in. Out of town pick a hotel with a charger. If you're able to charge 25% or 75 miles in an hour that'll last a couple days for most and it's right there.

It's very rare that people drive hundreds of miles a day. That's 36k miles per year, they structure leases at 10,12,15k max because that fits 90% of drivers. It's rare a 3 year old car has 100k miles on it. Now I drive a lot, like over 50k a year but I have a bunch of cars and pick the one that fits my needs for that trip.

Most people only have one car. So, it has to cover all needs.
Definitely a niche market for now. But I'm sure that it will improve.
It won't stop me from moving forward. I'll just build my own, to suit my needs.
But adoption by the general public is still a long way out.

 

[justinm001]

Most people only have one car. So, it has to cover all needs.
Definitely a niche market for now. But I'm sure that it will improve.
It won't stop me from moving forward. I'll just build my own, to suit my needs.
But adoption by the general public is still a long way out.

This is where its wrong. It's not niche but covers 95%+ of people's needs.

Also it doesn't need to cover all needs. You can easily rent a car if going out of town or a truck if moving or whatever. There isn't a car that covers all needs now and anything thats better suited for one need compromises in another.

The point is range anxiety isn't realistic. There are chargers everywhere even if they take a few hours. Most evs are over 250miles and it's very very rare for people to drive over 250miles in a day.

If 90% of Americans who drive have access to install an ev charger at their home then they don't need to worry about multiple days on average to charge, but even then it can last a week for most people.

The 10% is of people who live in an apartment without access to power outside would need to find one of these chargers and something to do for a few hours a week or stop by a Tesla station for 45minutes a week.. worst case.

Even the supercharger stations are optimizes throughout town so it isn't too far for anyone.

The concept is proven. EV cars work and are here to stay. Market share is growing like crazy and will reach the point of mass adoption very soon.

Cadillac just announced its Escalade EV and they're basically bringing all vehicles an EV option here soon.

 

[timselectric]

There are chargers everywhere even if they take a few hours.

That's where it's unacceptable.
You can fill up at a gas station in under 5 minutes.
EV's can't even come close to competing with that.

 

[timselectric]

Market share is growing like crazy and will reach the point of mass adoption very soon.

Mass adoption is many years away.
It definitely will happen. But not for a long while.
I know a lot of people. Friends, coworkers, customers. I only know one person who has an EV. And only because I helped a coworker install a charger for their customer. So, I really don't know them. I only know of them.

 

[justinm001]

Mass adoption is many years away.
It definitely will happen. But not for a long while.
I know a lot of people. Friends, coworkers, customers. I only know one person who has an EV. And only because I helped a coworker install a charger for their customer. So, I really don't know them. I only know of them.

Evs will never come close to filling up like gas because it's not needed. It takes 5 seconds to plug in an ev everyday when you get home. Trust me it's so much nicer to just plug it in than to stop and get gas all the time.

The biggest problem with EVs is there aren't many options yet. There all weird and different. For instance I drive sports cars and there aren't any sports cars for some reason, closes is a Taycan.. which I pre-ordered and was going to replace my panamera but when they announced it was going to be called a turbo I canceled. If they made a 911 EV I'd buy it today.

We're finally getting "normal" cars. We have the Lyric and the Lightning. MB and BMW are finally making models that look more normal and in the next few years we should be getting many GM cars that have EV equilivent.

Chrysler has all kinds of bhev. I see a ton of 4xe jeeps and minivans

you don't know many because not that many people get new cars. Even if 10% of new cars sold are EV it'll be years before its 10% of all cars.

I would be shocked if in 5 years we don't see 30% of new cars sold being EV. We're at 6% already now.

 

[timselectric]

Evs will never come close to filling up like gas because it's not needed. It takes 5 seconds to plug in an ev everyday when you get home. Trust me it's so much nicer to just plug it in than to stop and get gas all the time.

Sure, because you have the ability to plug in at home.
I do too, so I definitely take that into consideration. Without that ability, it would definitely be a no sell.
But a lot of people do not. And it's not just apartments and condos. A lot of people rent homes. And the landlord may not allow the outlet to be installed. A lot of rental properties have a minimum service. And would require upgrading the service. Some landlords might see it as a selling point. Most will just see it as an unwanted added expense.

 

[justinm001]

Sure, because you have the ability to plug in at home.
I do too, so I definitely take that into consideration. Without that ability, it would definitely be a no sell.
But a lot of people do not. And it's not just apartments and condos. A lot of people rent homes. And the landlord may not allow the outlet to be installed. A lot of rental properties have a minimum service. And would require upgrading the service. Some landlords might see it as a selling point. Most will just see it as an unwanted added expense.

You don't need to install a l2 charger. You can use a l1 charger into a normal outlet in those cases. Sure it's only 4 or so miles per hour charge but overnight you're looking at a good 50 miles. I did this multiple times when at an airbnb and renting an ev.

Also most laundry rooms are right next to the front door or garage and you can just use that with an extension cord to get l2 charging 30amps.

 

[Ampster]

I only know one person who has an EV.

EV adoption varies significantly around the country. In my 14 home block in Northern California there are 4 EVs. I also know at least 20 friends and relatives who have EVs. I have no way to predict how soon they will become mainstream but in China and much of Europe the adoption rate is much higher than in the US, so the global trend is fairly clear as far as developed nations is concerned.

 

[timselectric]

You don't need to install a l2 charger. You can use a l1 charger into a normal outlet in those cases. Sure it's only 4 or so miles per hour charge but overnight you're looking at a good 50 miles. I did this multiple times when at an airbnb and renting an ev.

Also most laundry rooms are right next to the front door or garage and you can just use that with an extension cord to get l2 charging 30amps.

I'm not saying that their aren't ways to make things work. I'm a diy'er, I can make anything work somehow.
But the general public isn't going to want to run a cord through a window or door. And unplug the dryer every time to charge their vehicle.

 

[timselectric]

EV adoption varies significantly around the country. In my 14 home block in Northern California there are 4 EVs. I also know at least 20 friends and relatives who have EVs. I have no way to predict how soon they will become mainstream but in China and much of Europe the adoption rate is much higher than in the US, so the global trend is fairly clear as far as developed nations is concerned.

Right
California is definitely adopting EV's , harder than the rest of the country. But, California is always trendy about things. They want whatever is new and "hip".

 

[Ampster]

But the general public isn't going to want to run a cord through a window or door. And unplug the dryer every time to charge their vehicle.

There are several devices that can switch between an EVSE and a dryer to solve that issue. I think anyone who seriously sees the benefit of an EV is also likely to see the long term benefit of a dedicated EVSE circuit. The general public includes a lot of people who are not ready for an an EV anyway so they are irrelevant.

 

[justinm001]

I'm not saying that their aren't ways to make things work. I'm a diy'er, I can make anything work somehow.
But the general public isn't going to want to run a cord through a window or door. And unplug the dryer every time to charge their vehicle.

You're right but the point is there's a simple solution for all the negative EV talking points.

There's lots of fear mongering and incorrect facts about how bad range anxiety really is. Just take a look at the used EV market and the prices are still insane

 

[Ampster]

There's lots of fear mongering and incorrect facts about how bad range anxiety really is.

And it comes from people who do not own EVs. I am sure the transition from horse and buggy to autos had the same issues. We just did not have the Internet then and the horse and buggy industry was not as powerful and vested as the fossil fuel industry is today.

 

[timselectric]

It doesn't really matter what the reasons are.
EV adoption is moving slowly. And will take many years. Better charging comfortability will make a huge difference.

 

[justinm001]

It doesn't really matter what the reasons are.
EV adoption is moving slowly. And will take many years. Better charging comfortability will make a huge difference.

I wouldn't consider it moving slowly. 6% of new car sales are EV when it's only like 2% of models.

If every vehicle had an EV option for the same price, it'd be well over 50% of new car sales.

 

[timselectric]

I wouldn't consider it moving slowly. 6% of new car sales are EV when it's only like 2% of models.

If every vehicle had an EV option for the same price, it'd be well over 50% of new car sales.

I disagree.
But that's OK. Everyone is entitled to their own opinions.

 

[justinm001]

I disagree.
But that's OK. Everyone is entitled to their own opinions.

Well find out soon especially as the blazer EV is about to come out. Also remember EVs aren't typically on lots and they all seem to have huge waiting lists. We're finally getting out of the covid chip shortage and I expect we'll be seeing a lot more EVs on the road. They've been selling EVs with both hands tied behind their backs. Supply problems coupled with fear mongering and now this anti Musk campaign all over