My daughter is shopping for an ev she is looking at a bolt

[Orangesauce]

Regarding range & efficiency. For my Ioniq5, there are so many regen and intelligent cruise control settings you can play with. Since watching three videos covering how the regen settings work (yes, training videos to learn how to drive? lol) I've gotten 30% more efficiency on short local drives.

Our personal EVs don't have one-pedal regen, but I drove a Tesla 3 rental that had it for two weeks and loved it. With a little practice, I rarely had to use the brake and never had to guess whether I was engaging the brake pads.

That said, I also drove Nurburgring in a different rented Tesla 3 on that trip and realized I was probably the most annoying car out there because the brake lights must have always been flickering on. Ick.

 

[Orangesauce]

Watch out for heavy rain, or anything that makes the road slick, it will literally kill it, as in cut your range in half

Also recalibrate what one expects on snowy curves. The weight of the batteries can cause the car to seek the outside of the curve relatively easily.

 

[ksmithaz1]

Also recalibrate what one expects on snowy curves. The weight of the batteries can cause the car to seek the outside of the curve relatively easily.

The torque is really going to goof in the snow, and you will want to turn regen off completely or you might end up sliding in a ditch. It's very disconcerting to have high regen and hit a decent sized bump while it's active. It is a very different feel. I still squeak the tires from time to time from a stop, without meaning to. An electric motor really wants to turn.

 

[wattmatters]

When asked how long my EV takes to charge I say

"about 15 seconds"

The time it take to open the flap and plug it in. The rest happens when I'm doing other things.

 

[zanydroid]

Our personal EVs don't have one-pedal regen, but I drove a Tesla 3 rental that had it for two weeks and loved it. With a little practice, I rarely had to use the brake and never had to guess whether I was engaging the brake pads.

That said, I also drove Nurburgring in a different rented Tesla 3 on that trip and realized I was probably the most annoying car out there because the brake lights must have always been flickering on. Ick.

The iPedal mode on the Hyundai platform is actually well known and measured to be less efficient than the other modes. Not exactly sure why. Fortunately I learned that before getting in the habit of using it and am now using Auto regen (uses the adaptive cruise control sensor to adjust Regen up and down when gliding). It's a little scary though because it acts so subtly that it is hard to learn how it behaves in different conditions.

You use one of the steering wheel paddles to request max regen braking; if you use the brake pedal it has a high chance of blending in the brakes at some point. The paddle is basically like a on-off video game controller input with no modulation, which makes it hard to stop smoothly.

 

[zanydroid]

I think aggressive regen is silly. I keep my cars at '1'. If you really want to one-pedal drive, more power to you, I'm old and I can't stand it. If you are agressively slowing down all the time you are wasting electricity, which means to maximize efficiency one-pedal, you have to keep pressure on the pedal easing it up to slow down.

Yeah I'm off the iPedal now after watching the videos. Using Auto with minimum set to Medium in the menus (this affects the low end of regen when auto is on level 1). I think using adaptive cruise on local streets for Regen is too aggressive at slowing and speeding and is less efficient vs using your brain to slow more smoothly.

Trying to decide how much I like braking with left paddle. Mostly driving solo since I got my car, when I get passengers I expect some feedback from how jerky paddle braking is.

 

[wattmatters]

OPD is quite good in my car. Don't use it much though as it's really best in city traffic. Mostly open roads where I am. I last used it coming down a winding mountain pass and it was excellent. Never needed the brakes.

 

[zanydroid]

I'll have to remember to compare Level 3 Regen to OPD on this car next time I'm going down a mountain. Would have to dare to take a road trip with a non-Tesla EV

 

[G00SE]

The USA is not most people. But I accept this is a forum likely dominated by readers from the USA.

Do y’all have BYD EV down there?

 

[Danke]

The USA is not most people. But I accept this is a forum likely dominated by readers from the USA.

Let’s do a survey and find out the readership of this forum.

IP CHECK ON AISLE THREE!

 

[Danke]

I ran some numbers for charging EV through new solar + buffer battery (off the shelf, not DIY) at those rates (basically what we have in California effective Jan 2024), and breakeven was within 5-7 years for the off-peak $0.35/kWh rate.

Did you take the same amount of money spent on that solar system and invested it to come up with your numbers?

 

[Hedges]

I would think the same applies to Solar for most people if they have the grid available. Wrong forum?

I think turnkey GT PV costs about $3.00/W, $0.10/kWh in the US. How much does battery cost, maybe also $0.10/kWh? How much is Tesla Powerwall, amortized over its life?

If $0.20/kWh together, that is competitive with peak rates in California, either without net metering or under NEM 3.0, but only sized for use it or lose it. (probably can't make 100% of your power that cheaply, but size system to offset on-peak usage.)

EV's are worth it if your application fits the use case, and you have a way to charge it without paying commercial charging rates. You need to keep the cost of charging in the $0.10-15/kwh range to generate the saving for the capital ROI. The maintenance is near nothing, you will chew up more tires. For general commuting they are really hard to beat.

If we could get power at those those rates, we could save a lot of money. And I'm not talking about EVs.

When I charge my car at EA, I bring my laptop and work. The first seat memory is the normal driving position and the second memory is "office mode". The heat pump does its thing and the car is charged before too long. I probably only have to go every couple weeks.

Quite a lifestyle change, to utilize EV and charging stations most cost-effectively.

"about 15 seconds"

The time it take to open the flap and plug it in. The rest happens when I'm doing other things.

Quite a difference from Orangehead's experience.

OPD is quite good in my car. Don't use it much though as it's really best in city traffic. Mostly open roads where I am. I last used it coming down a winding mountain pass and it was excellent. Never needed the brakes.

Regenerative braking could be useful where braking is required, like long steep hills. Otherwise, it's purpose is primarily for people who don't take their foot off the gas early when approaching a stop.

Who was it who kept arguing that ICE powered generator to recharge was less efficient than mechanically coupled to wheels? How about electric drive train (or ICE) to move car, then slow it back down by means of road coupled to tires to regenerative braking?

 

[Danke]

I think turnkey GT PV costs about $3.00/W, $0.10/kWh in the US. How much does battery cost, maybe also $0.10/kWh? How much is Tesla Powerwall, amortized over its life?

If $0.20/kWh together, that is competitive with peak rates in California, either without net metering or under NEM 3.0, but only sized for use it or lose it. (probably can't make 100% of your power that cheaply, but size system to offset on-peak usage.)

One thing people never consider is, had the money been invested instead of put into a solar system. That plus possible insurance increases and possible future reroofing, dismantling, etc. Depending on the warranty offered, may have other cost in the future.

 

[Orangesauce]

You use one of the steering wheel paddles to request max regen braking; if you use the brake pedal it has a high chance of blending in the brakes at some point.

Admittedly what I’m after is not touching the brake pads in normal driving, but also know it’s impractical to regenerate to zero. The Tesla blends the brake at the very end of the stop cycle and does so without the tiny lockup at the end of the process. They did that right.

The original Audi EV has traffic sensing regen, which is pretty great. Even without OPD or having the cruise control on, it will start regen when you are coasting and the car ahead starts braking. But the other Audi doesn’t seem to do that unless cruise control is on. It took a while to realize that and it would be better with some documentation.

 

[Q-Dog]

One thing people never consider is, had the money been invested instead of put into a solar system. That plus possible insurance increases and possible future reroofing, dismantling, etc. Depending on the warranty offered, may have other cost in the future.

We "invested" in solar. Our regular investments are doing fine the past 3 years but still haven't fully recovered from the covid crash.

 

[zanydroid]

Did you take the same amount of money spent on that solar system and invested it to come up with your numbers?

I did not factor in opportunity cost of money, if I include that fewer solar projects would get done at my house. Let's say those forgone returns are canceled out by the saved therapy bills from not raging at the POCO

 

[zanydroid]

If $0.20/kWh together, that is competitive with peak rates in California, either without net metering or under NEM 3.0, but only sized for use it or lose it. (probably can't make 100% of your power that cheaply, but size system to offset on-peak usage.)

I think it is reasonable to size system to support 9 months of driving. Not sure where the balance point in the summer between clipping on kWh because out of battery, vs buying more battery. One way to solve it is selling excess to neighbors parking their EVs in your driveway

The original Audi EV has traffic sensing regen, which is pretty great. Even without OPD or having the cruise control on, it will start regen when you are coasting and the car ahead starts braking. But the other Audi doesn’t seem to do that unless cruise control is on.

On Hyundai cruise control can brake to zero and speed up. On Auto regen, OPD is off, increases Regen if it sees slowing ahead, only brakes to 6mph (need to use either brake pedal or brake paddle), and does not speed up. I'm not super convinced this user experience is safe vs OPD, auto off, which always behaves the same; Cruise control also slams the brakes sooner than auto (if auto even does that) if someone stops.

I'm sorry of embarrassed to insist my family members to learn this for their driving. It's a bit extra.

 

[ksmithaz1]

You use one of the steering wheel paddles to request max regen braking; if you use the brake pedal it has a high chance of blending in the brakes at some point. The paddle is basically like a on-off video game controller input with no modulation, which makes it hard to stop smoothly.

It is my understanding that the brakes will not "Blend" on an EV unless you are either :

1) Below a certain speed. This is like 3-5MPH and quite obvious on my cars when you hit that point.
(or)
2) You completely shower down on the pedal and engage ABS. (panic stop)

If you have an article that contradicts this I would be interested to read it. I spent quite a bit of time looking for this and other related information as to why a stiffer regen is more efficient. Everyone kept saying it, nobody has any data I've found to back it up. It is not possible that using agressive regen, after acceleration is more efficient than simply watching the traffic ahead and coasting. That would defy the laws of physics, there is more loss turning the kinetic energy back into electricity than simply using the kinetic energy to propel the car forward. From a huh? standpoint the more aggressively you convert that kinetic energy the more loss you must take. Other factors could be at play, but It seems to me that a longer more steady regen is preferable to pumping the brakes, but I can't find anything there either. The around town range I get would seem to indicate I'm not on the wrong course.

While I find these kinds of things interesting and amusing, a ton of research, and the general experience of over 100 years of driving automobiles, we ended up where we are today with a steering wheel and two pedals. If I could I would remove the stupid paddles on the steering wheel, and make regen a selector knob or dash programmable. No way I want to be fiddling with that mess and get distracted or confused driving around town in traffic. The biggest problem I have with this is ocassionally accidentally bumping the paddle and having the regen suddenly become more aggressive. Now that is annoying.

I have a friend that only likes to drive a manual transmission. I get it, it's fun for a time, and your automatic response mechs kick in as you learn the car, but at the end of the day, it's more work, for no benefit these days. A computer and a DCT can shift way more optimally than you ever will.

 

[ksmithaz1]

I think it is reasonable to size system to support 9 months of driving. Not sure where the balance point in the summer between clipping on kWh because out of battery, vs buying more battery. One way to solve it is selling excess to neighbors parking their EVs in your driveway


On Hyundai cruise control can brake to zero and speed up. On Auto regen, OPD is off, increases Regen if it sees slowing ahead, only brakes to 6mph (need to use either brake pedal or brake paddle), and does not speed up. I'm not super convinced this user experience is safe vs OPD, auto off, which always behaves the same; Cruise control also slams the brakes sooner than auto (if auto even does that) if someone stops.

I'm sorry of embarrassed to insist my family members to learn this for their driving. It's a bit extra.

I use the adaptive speed control stop feature not-infrequently. The roads here lend themselves, you might go 3-5 miles in a modicum of traffic, and if the person in front of me is gradually slowing for the occasional stop, it's kind of fun to play with, but it will sometimes aggressively slow down, you have to pay attention.

 

[zanydroid]

is my understanding that the brakes will not "Blend" on an EV unless you are either :

1) Below a certain speed. This is like 3-5MPH and quite obvious on my cars when you hit that point.
(or)
2) You completely shower down on the pedal and engage ABS. (panic stop)

If you have an article that contradicts this I would be interested to read it. I spent quite a bit of time looking for this and other related information as to why a stiffer regen is more efficient. Everyone kept saying it, nobody has any data I've found to back it up. It is not possible that using agressive regen, after acceleration is more efficient than simply watching the traffic ahead and coasting.

I'm not making any such claim (except accidentally). Aggressive Regen is likely slightly efficient from heating, and the round trip anyway is probably only 70% efficient. Better to try to have just the fundamental inefficiencies like rolling resistance and drag. Now aggressive regen may be more time efficient or mileage efficient if you spend more time at speed limit and therefore get more miles from each acceleration from stop.

The concern about blending was exceeding the max regen from foot action (and a good blend would make it hard to detect, I need to find a visual indicator in the car). I know roughly what the max regen is from the iPedal behavior and paddle brake behavior. The max regen is below ABS threshold.